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Passively Invest In Short-Term Rentals (AKA Airbnbs) With Sief Khafagi – Real Estate For Women

REW Sief Khafagi | Short Term Rentals


The journey to cash flow and growth can be difficult. It is time-consuming and requires a lot of effort and dedication. How can you break the cycle of working from 9 to 5? In this episode, Sief Khafagi, founder of Techvestor, builds a mouse trap that allows you to create a cash flow through passively investing in short-term rentals, aka Airbnb. Having short-term rentals on your portfolio for the cash flow can be a powerful wealth-building strategy. Are you interested in getting extra insights from Sief? Then don’t miss this episode!

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Passively Invest In Short-Term Rentals (AKA Airbnbs) With Sief Khafagi – Real Estate For Women

Real Estate Investing For Women

I am excited to welcome to the show, Sief Khafagi. Isn’t that the most amazing name? Sief is an ex-techy turned real estate investor who has helped thousands diversify into real estate after spending nearly five years at Facebook. He syndicated acquisitions totaling more than $100 million while designing and developing more than 25 properties. Now, he’s the Founder of Techvestor, which helps real estate investors and busy professionals passively invest in the emergent asset class of short-term rentals, AKA Airbnbs. Sief, welcome to the show.

Thank you so much for having me. It’s amazing. Your energy is infectious.

I love that, and I loved our conversation in the green room. I feel the same way about you.

I’m very excited to be here, so thank you for having us.

Talk to me a little bit about how did you come up with this idea of Techvestor? You go from tech. I’m from the Silicon Valley. I now live in Sacramento but I was originally in Silicon Valley. We lived very close to Facebook, Google, and LinkedIn. How did you go from tech to real estate and then come up with this idea? Could you share?

A fun fact, I was living literally across the street from Facebook’s campus when I was at Facebook. During the times I wasn’t there, I was doing a lot of traveling, opening up offices, recruiting teams, and generally, we stayed in Airbnbs. A bunch of those Airbnbs was pretty shitty, to be quite honest with you. The design sucked. The host experience was weird.

The whole journey was always top of mind. I was like, “I’m going to stay in another Airbnb.” It’s because we are staying in these cities sometimes for a little bit longer than a day or two and you want that local experience. Sabrina and I, when we started Techvestor, we were starting it for ourselves. We were like, “How can we buy our own 6, 10 or 12 short-term rentals?”

We were all traveling as much as before the pandemic. We were used to working remotely. To do that, we started building technology. No surprise. We are building technology to help automate the process of understanding where we want to buy. We wanted something that was great cashflow, great equity growth, good occupancy, good rates, and places we wanted to visit. We built our software. We started as a software company.

We shared it with everyone around us, and everyone loved our software to basically help find short-term rental opportunities. No one wanted to do the work themselves. They were like, “This sounds great but I don’t want to do it but can I give you money, and you can go do it yourself?” We were like, “Okay.” We did about 6 or 7 that way for clients.

When we got them all in a room or a virtual room because of the pandemic, Zoom, etc. they were all like, “I like yours. I would wish I had a piece of yours and that one.” They were describing a syndication, a fund, a portfolio or something along those lines. We pivoted to this portfolio short-term rentals or a fund, for lack of a better word here.

Our investors were super excited about that. We announced it around Halloween of 2021. In our first month, we raised $7 million. We went viral and went with it. To date, we’ve raised $20 million. The idea came from this pain point of understanding being the user. Also, coming from tech, we saw so much opportunity. Those iPhone 4 camera photos you see on Airbnb or the host that’s not getting back to you. You walk into a bedroom, and it’s a mattress, and that’s it.

We were like, “We could do this better.” A lot of low-hanging fruit, so we looked into it. Coming from a technical background, we understand the product of Airbnb and the user journey. We built a private equity real estate concept backed by the premise of understanding the user journey of a technical product. While it seems complex, that’s where we come from. That was our perspective.

It was interesting. When I lived in Mountain View, we ran an Airbnb out of our house. I became a superhost very quickly. As a matter of fact, I got a full-paid trip to Paris for Airbnb, the big shindig that they have every year.

The Superhost Party.

People said this over and over again, “This place is so nice.” We literally had a bedroom and a bathroom attached. It was my little library, so we decorated it the way that I would like my library like a guest room. I was surprised over and over again. We created experience. We provided coffee. We did some things that I would want in the morning but nothing special. It was interesting to me how people were like, “We will pay you more. Hold the room. We want to come every month or whatever.”

It blew up. I was completely surprised by this whole thing. We didn’t do a lot that was special. You were telling me this experience gives me a little more perspective. What was funny was that the guests would not tell me why. They were like, “Your place is nicer than everybody else.” They didn’t want me to raise my rates, I’m sure.

They were like, “We like these rates.”

I paid more than our mortgage. We cashflowed one bedroom in the house. This is in Silicon Valley with this room that was kept like a sweet guest room. It is interesting what we can do with Airbnb if we pay a little bit of attention.

However, if you go back to that experience, I would be willing to bet. The downsides of what you described as a host are the cleans and the guest communication. Everything that you have to do to earn that cashflow. It’s a job. We can both agree that it’s a job. Someone has got to do it and make sure that the guest is having a good time.

Part of that was the experience, the room, the pricing, everything but it was a job. Techvestor, what we are doing is solving that part. We’re saying, “If you want to invest in short-term rentals, you want to earn that cashflow but don’t want to have the headaches or the time, energy, know-how to do this or the want but want the benefit of it. You can do so passively. We are one of the first options to invest in short-term rentals passively for the busy professional. We will clean the toilet, and you collect the cashflow.

I love that because you are right. I turned it to where you had to stay at least three nights. I got tired of changing sheets.

They got to be worth your time.

Fortunately, most of my guests stayed for about a week, so I was only doing it once a week, and it was fantastic. There was a lot that we did. I would say I probably spent about ten hours a week doing that, which is not a lot of time considering that it paid for my entire mortgage and cashflow but still, it was time out of my schedule. Maybe not ten hours. Maybe closer to five, and we did other things. I enjoyed meeting the guests.

I would take them for a walk around the neighborhood and show them where to go get good morning coffee rather than the drip that I was providing at home. We did a little bit of that stuff, so that took a little time too. You are right. I wouldn’t say it was a job because it didn’t take that much time but required time.

During the holidays, I did not want to have people in my house and did not want to be dealing with this. I’m so with you, Sief. Why I have you on this show is because I know that side. It’s what made me stop. I’m interested in what you are offering. It’s amazing. I’m curious. You gave me a little bit of an idea of why you focused on short-term rentals. I know you’ve got some stats on why that makes more sense. Could you talk to me a little bit more about why you chose short-term rentals and how that works?

The first thing for us was our personal motivations for why we got into short-term rentals. Sabrina and I were working in tech in the Valley, making these big cushy compensation salaries that everyone jokes about. We were both single, and each of us was sharing a home with people we were working with. Making more money, handing over piss that we knew what to do with.

It was a privileged position to be in, for sure. It gave us this opportunity and perspective to think about, “What else can we invest in that’s not your typical 401(k), equities or whatever”? Crypto wasn’t even like that hot back then, as much as it’s now. We started thinking about short-term rentals, and we wanted cashflow.

For us, it was also about breaking away from the 9:00 to 5:00 or at least the feel of being in a 9:00 to 5:00 as quickly as possible or having the choice to and the time freedom. The fastest way to cashflow for us is short-term rentals. It was also the easiest to get into because of the lack of competition. When you combine those things together, you are like, “Great margins. Little to no competition.” That’s like the heaven of any business you are going to enter into. Supply and demand are completely in your favor. We looked at our own experiences of what we could bring to the table, and we were like, “This is something that we could add a lot of value to.”

Short-term rentals, from an industry perspective, you are going to generate, if you are doing it right, 2 and a half to 5 times the long-term rents of a property. Typically, if you are understanding where to buy, what to buy, and how to best operate. It’s a three prolonged approach. Some of that stuff we’ve built proprietary software around to understand what to buy and market-mapping certain things.

The operating side is the experience of our fantastic team, which I know we are going to talk a little bit about later. Having an operating team that understands how to price, how to communicate with guests, where to build automation, where not to build automation, how to make it feel human, how to design, and how to rank right. Airbnb is very much like Google. If you rank on the first page of Google, guess what? You are going to get clicks. If you rank on the 100th page of Google, you are not going to get clicks as much.

How do you rank in it? Therefore, by understanding these things, that’s why we decided to focus on STR. It was also such an emerging market. Here’s a fun fact, over 50% of all short-term rentals came online after 2020. People are starting to recognize that short-term rentals are something that everyone and their moms have started to want to do.

It predominantly kicked off probably around the pandemic when you look at the data. Everyone was like, “I want an STR. Low-interest rates, I can do this.” What you are realizing is that you start to see this churn of hosts. It’s easy to be an Airbnb owner and an Airbnb host. It’s hard to stay one. That’s where people like us who come from a professional perspective understand what it takes. We have the operating capabilities to do so, the design capabilities, and it’s also diversified for us.

We also wanted something where we could be easily diversified instead of owning three single families in a single area. It’s like, how can we own 100 of them in 10 markets? You and I both know Airbnb is seasonal. You have your ups and your downs. We wanted winter, summer, and fall months and all these types of things to allow great cashflow throughout the year.

REW Sief Khafagi | Short Term Rentals

Short-Term Rentals: Airbnb is seasonal. You have ups and downs, so we wanted winter, summer, and fall months to allow a great cash flow throughout the year.


What I’m noticing is that one of the big reasons that I did not continue with Airbnb when I moved back to the San Jose area is the tax rates in San Jose, for instance, with Airbnb. They suddenly started charging you with all the same tax rates that they do with the hotels. Are you noticing that’s happening across the country? How is that affecting profits for Airbnb owners?

One of the things that we see in most markets is 90% plus of the markets. Airbnb is going to collect those the hotel and occupancy tax that you are talking about for you as a host. At least now, that cost is typically charged to the guest. In fact, even in the hotel industry, it’s typically charged to the guests. It’s not an uncommon thing for Airbnb to do.

We don’t see it affecting us at all because it’s a common thing. You expect to pay some tax or fee. Whether you are booking a hotel or an Airbnb, you are booking the same thing. For us, we feel it significantly less because most of our homes are larger homes, 4 or 5-bedroom homes. We don’t focus on things like condos or 1 or 2-bedroom homes.

When you think about the economies of scale that we get or the economics for a family who’s traveling, and I’m a dad of two, I can’t imagine my wife and I, going and staying in a hotel with two kids. She can’t do it. There’s no way. That would be such a chaotic experience. How are they going to get entertained? Where are they going to go play? Where are they going to go run around? We don’t have a kitchen.

There are certain things that we need, and the economics of an Airbnb make way more sense when you are in a group of 4, 6, 8 or 10, versus if you are traveling alone. You are like, “I’m going to a conference. Is it for business? Is it for pleasure? I want to stay downtown.” What matters? Amenities matter to bigger groups and that’s what we focus on.

Most of the Airbnbs that I was seeing, especially, for instance, in Mountain View, my competition I checked out might be a four-bedroom but they were little. They had single beds set up and a shared bathroom type of thing. I like your idea of more of a luxurious experience. Maybe not fully luxury but a luxurious experience where people are not like, “I’m on this bunk bed. This is horrible.”

It’s amazing what we do with our design. I will have to send you some of our listings after. You will get a sense. We have the front of a Volvo car. We cut the front of a little Volvo car and stuck it in one of our living rooms to create a tiki Volvo bar. We have basketball courts, hot tubs, pools, and iconic Instagramable moments where you can take photos with your family or for yourself.

These are things you are not going to get in a traditional Airbnb or you are going to get into a hotel. We believe we are building the next generation of experiences through these amenities and designs. You and I can both agree, your space matters, your office, where you sleep, and where you eat. Especially if you are relaxing on vacation and traveling, your space matters even more. We hone into that ethos. We see it. We drive higher occupancies. Fifty percent more occupancy than our competitors. We are driving typically almost 40% more revenue than our competitors because we are giving people what they are craving but they can’t find.

Your space matters even more if you're relaxing on vacation and traveling. Share on X

How would you say your pricing compares to hotels? When I was in the Airbnb games, it was early on. For us, my pricing was less than the local hotels. I’m hearing more in the industry. That’s not the case anymore. How do you price in comparison to local hotels? Do you even consider that? What are your considerations around pricing?

We look at hotel pricing and other accommodations but 9 times out of 10, we are always more economical than hotels. We are cheaper than hotels, and it’s because of the type of asset we focus on. For each market that we enter, we have what’s called a Buy Box. There are specific types of properties we buy, for example, in a market like Scottsdale. I will never buy something as of now, based on the price-to-rent ratio. That’s not a four-bedroom or higher with a pool. The reason for that is because, at a four-bedroom or higher, it makes incredible economic sense. The margins are fantastic. If it doesn’t have a pool, it’s a non-starter for me in that market. We know what to buy.

I spoke to a hotel speaking at a conference in the Midwest in January 2022. It was $684 per room. We booked 2 rooms, so it was $1,300 for 3 days for 2 people. It gives you some context there. There were those fees that you talked about. Now, if we were traveling with a group of 8, would we have booked 8 different rooms? That becomes expensive at that price point versus getting a fantastic Airbnb in that market and being able to all stay together. Walls defeat experiences. That’s our belief. That’s a thing. If you’ve ever traveled with your family and have stayed in a hotel, what happens when everyone goes to the room? It’s almost like a pause in your trip.

It’s almost like it interrupts your trip. For us, we focus on bigger groups. I’m going to say bigger groups. I’m talking about typically six plus. When you are six plus, it’s way more economical to do an Airbnb 9 times out of 10 with us. You get more for your money, a better location, better amenities, easier check-in, privacy, and a lot of different things that are going to matter more to you at that point.

It’s interesting to me that you choose pools. I do the opposite for liability reasons. Do you want to speak to that a little?

The ability to have a pool drives your ADR significantly. ADR, for those who aren’t aware, is your average daily rate, which is whatever you are able to charge on a nightly basis. We have insurance in place for those types of things. We have proper gates for kids, for example. To us, the risk is well worth the reward. It’s more about being protected. There are pools everywhere. I don’t think we can control what happens at an Airbnb. We are not there. We obviously try to prevent anything that we can but some things aren’t preventable, unfortunately, but the liability is a liability. That’s a liability for us that’s worth taking on.

Do they usually have hot tubs?

A lot of our properties. In fact, back in Scottsdale, it’s a priority for us to have hot tubs as an example. In every market, we know what needs to be had in terms of the amenities and how they should be designed. For example, our clear water market, compared to Scottsdale, is very different in terms of the amenities that you would expect to have.

However, both pools are 100%. Other amenities are very different. In Scottsdale, we have a baby pink house. That’s like bachelorette heaven. We have a play on Tiffany’s home. In Scottsdale, you got clear water, and we have a sunset home. It’s more appealing to families. We have a room where there are all these animals that are handcrafted on the wall. Why? It’s because kids are going to more likely stay there than they are in the Scottsdale-type market. It’s understanding your client and catering to the experience that they are craving.

REW Sief Khafagi | Short Term Rentals

Short-Term Rentals: Understand your client and cater to the experience they’re craving.


A couple of more questions. How many markets are you in?

We are in nine.

We are going to talk, ladies, in EXTRA about how he chooses those markets specifically. He uses his software. This is interesting stuff that he can help provide for you but we are going to talk deeper in EXTRA about that. Why don’t you give us a high level of how they can utilize your software, then we will do a deep dive in EXTRA?

Our software allows us to do a couple of things. We market map over 257 different markets. Market mapping is understanding the supply of that market, what comes into the market, and what’s needed in that market. It’s giving us all this raw data. We then take that raw data and map it to the highest performing Airbnb’s in that market.

We simply do what we call copy and paste. What we want to do is we don’t believe we are going to reinvent the market. We believe we can operate better but we don’t expect to. We simply take what’s the best possible property we can buy in this market at the specific price-to-rent ratio. We add the amenities that are required for that property and copy and paste them over to ours.

We believe we can operate it better because 95% of the time, we are competing against mom-and-pops who are not using technology or automation, have our design experience, and have our capital backing. Therefore, we are able to go in and increase the ceiling of that type of property. Therefore, driving the best risk-adjusted returns. We are taking what’s working, and our data tells us what’s working. We are taking our operational excellence to improve it, and that’s what allows us to create our general alpha about that.

One of the things that come to mind for me is, as an Airbnb host, the reason that I was cashflowing on the mortgages in the Bay Area was that I did not hire a company to handle it all. I hired cleaning and all of that stuff but when I looked at Santa Cruz. There are all these companies that popped up to run Airbnb for you remotely but they took such a high percentage. It’s like having a management company in California. You don’t even breakeven in a lot of cases. Talk to me a little bit about what fees you charge and how that translates as far as profitability for owners.

One of the things that we do that’s interesting and predominantly because of that is with high-interest rates, high inflation, all these things are going to eat into your operating profits. It’s because we run a portfolio on behalf of our community. We don’t charge an ongoing property management fee. In fact, what we do is we do what we call property management buy down.

We buy down your typical property management rate from the industry average down to zero. Let me explain what that means. The industry average is 20% to 40%. It’s high. If you are driving $100,000 in revenue, let’s use 30% here as an even number, you are going to pay $30,000 of your gross revenue. Not profit but gross to said property management company.

To be quite honest, it’s probably worthwhile for many people because it’s a lot of time, energy, and resources to get it done correctly. What we do is instead of charging an ongoing fee, we project to hold our properties for about five years. We collect the property management fee on day one. That’s equivalent to a percentage of the property purchase price, and that’s it.

That’s the only fee that we collect. That goes towards managing the properties for the next five years. Many people would be like, “Why would you do that?” The first reason is what you described. If you are optimizing for cashflow, the two biggest things that will impact your cashflow will be your cost of debt, your mortgage, and the cost of management.

We can’t control debt. It is what it is. It will go up. It will go down. Your leverage, 9 times out of 10 is usually a good thing when it’s responsible debt. One thing we can control is buying down the property management rate as far low as possible, as close to zero as possible. By doing that, you increase your upfront cost with that property.

One thing we can control is buying down the property management rate as close to zero as possible. Share on X

We can do that because we are running an institutional-size fund. It allows for increased cashflows over the short-term. It allows us when we sell to sell based on revenues of higher NOI. When you sell something based on a cap rate. Those are some of the reasons why for us, we’ve chosen this model, and everything is a trade-off in business.

Everything is a trade-off in investment, so we are choosing cashflow. We are picking the model that allows us to operate with the highest yield possible because that’s what this investment is for. If you want tax benefits or high equity growth, or those types of things, you are going to go invest in some other asset class but for us, that’s what this asset class is good for.

You must come in with more cash if you buy down that management. It’s buying down your rate. I pay 1 or 2 points. You have to come in with more cash to create the cashflow. Is that true?

We are doing that but we also have the ability to do that because we are vertically integrated, and our fund is eight figures. For us, we have the capital to do it. Now, as an investor, if you were to work with us and invest with us, you would get the benefits of that. That’s things that we are able to negotiate and execute at scale. You can’t do this very easily, if at all, as an individual owner with a property or two.

This is where that scalable component is in working with an institutional fact operator like us. It gives you this flexibility of doing. It works for both sides because that capital goes to funding the property management for those five years, the technology that drives better occupancy and revenue team, all those types of things. It aligns interests on both.

Sief, you do not manage properties for other people.

Now we don’t.

Talk to me about your business model. What is it that you do? It sounds like you’ve got your technology. Do you sell the technology to people so that they can utilize it in their own businesses? Talk to me a little bit about how your personal business model works.

We run a fund, again, for lack of a better word. In a fund, there are typically a couple of parties. There is a general partner, and there are a lot of limited partners. Oftentimes, there are things like property management or affiliated companies. We are the general partner. We find, design, furnish, and operate the properties. We work with limited partners who give us money, give us capital, and we pull that money together. Our minimum check size is about $25,000.

We can work with 200 people who give us $25,000 as an example. They put all this money into a pool. We use that pool to buy these properties. We run and operate them. Our investors are going to get what’s called a preferred return. They get the first X percent, 6%, 10%, whatever that rate is going to be that we agree on in our PPM and things that we talk about.

We, as a general partner, are going to share above that preferred. We are incentivized to deliver the best possible returns. I can give you an example. Let’s say the preferred return is 8%. After you get 8%, the general partner starts sharing in the profits above that. That could be 50%, 70% or 80% of the profits. What that split looks like is how we generate money as a general partner.

If we are managing the property, we have affiliated business lines, for example, property management revenue, software revenue or those other types of things. That’s, in a nutshell, generally how our business works and we are highly incentivized to drive the most profitable returns to incentivize reinvestments, to incentivize capital, and solve the pain point of the DIY-er who’s thinking, “I want to do this but I don’t want to do all this myself.”

Is this more of a fond or more of syndication?

They are highly very similar in many ways. Depending on the words you want to use here. We syndicate capital in a fund-to-model, for lack of a better word.

The investors get the benefit of an interest rate. They are basically lending you money. You are calling it a preferred rate. Do they benefit on the back end of the sale because you put in a lot of improvements? You buy this place, and then you add value. The value of that when you sell it is hopefully going to go up, especially when you prove the numbers of what it’s paying you. Do the investors get any benefit from that?

Investors share in everything, cashflow, and depreciation, which is huge for taxes. We pass 100% of depreciation along to our LPs. They share in the upside in sales. When we exit, we have to return all their money back first before we make any money. All of these things are what we call pro-rata. Investors sharing every possible revenue stream from that property on the cashflow, depreciation, appreciation, cap rate sale or whatever ends up happening with that property get their share.

You say that most of your terms are about five years. You started this model probably in 2021. Have you closed any of these out yet and paid out your investors? Tell me a little bit about that.

We distribute capital quarterly or distributions quarterly. We haven’t missed a distribution. We had one of our best distributions, one of our best quarters in Q3, so that distribution is coming up. We’ve exited eight total assets. Of our eight exits, we’ve delivered about a 42% IRR on the ones that we have exited. Our track record, while it may be young to an extent because we are only about a year-old company.

We’ve been able to prove the model out with those first-aid exits. The reason we sold those eight early is for that reason. It’s to prove we could buy this asset, which is a single-family home, turn it into this other asset of a short-term rental, and sell that short-term rental as a business, for lack of a better word. Revenue-generating business like your one-bedroom was.

If your entire home is making $30,000 a month and your alternative is to sell it for $600,000. You are thinking very differently about what the value is of that home as you can a revenue-generating asset. Not only do we do that one time. We did it eight different times to prove that we could execute and scale that way. That’s why our traction has picked up a lot of steam over these last few months.

Could you explain IRR again, just so my ladies know?

IRR is your Internal Rate of Return. It’s arguably one of the best metrics to understand your time value of money. It factors in your returns from cashflow and your returns from the sale. It does not factor in anything like depreciation. IRR weights capital differently. The earlier you get a return back, AKA earlier cashflow, the it weighs that higher, and it formulates the algorithm way rather than if you were to get all your money back in year five.

I would give you an example. If you doubled your money in five years and you put in $100,000 on day 1 and in month 60, you got $200,000, that’s about a 14.8% IRR. Alternatively, if you were getting 10% a year and then a lump sum in year five. Your IRR may be higher because you earned more money earlier, so it weighs time as well. We believe it’s one of the best understandings holistically of a return.

Talk to us about your team.

There’s one thing I’m proudest of. It’s that we have been able to build an incredible operating team. This is a huge reason why a lot of people have considered investing with us or have invested with us. We have an incredible STR-specific team. What I mean by that is everyone from our Head of Acquisition, Taylor, to John, our Head of data, to people on our investor relations team, to myself and Sabrina, to Austin Decorbin, our Head of Revenue, Head of Property, everything. We come from this world.

REW Sief Khafagi | Short Term Rentals

Short-Term Rentals: We’ve been able to build an incredible operating team, which is a huge reason why many people have considered investing with us or have invested with us.


We’ve dealt with this world. We’ve scaled portfolios before. We’ve scaled infrastructure. Sabrina built AirPods at Apple and got to a billion dollars in revenue. I’ve built teams from 90 people to over 1,100. John is literally known as the Airbnb data guy. I’ve never met a hunter or a sniper from an acquisition perspective in the STR space more capable than Taylor.

These are people who are on our team exclusively. They are the ones who are managing this portfolio to drive this performance. If there’s any one piece of advice that I would share with anyone is if you are investing in syndication or a fund or you are giving your money to someone else, 9 times out of 10, the team matters more than the investment team.

I agree with you on that.

A good team will be able to navigate choppy waters. A good team will be able to drive better-than-average performance. A good team will earn whatever their share in their weight of gold easily. A bad team can easily drive your investment to the ground very fast. It’s not hard to lose money. It’s very hard to make it.

Team and expertise within the domain that you are investing in are important. You are betting on that team. That team or that horse is the one that’s going to get you through the finish line. That’s why we are awesome to have the talent. Out of any companies in this space or any other syndications in this space, we believe we, by far, have the best operating team in the space.

How did you find them? How did you build that team?

They will joke with you. My role at Facebook was that I built teams and recruited hundreds of people over the years. I slid into all their DMs. Taylor introduced John to us. I was like, “Taylor, here’s what we are doing. I love what you are doing. You clearly have a passion for this. I would love to talk to you about what we are doing.” We headhunted our team.

They were purposely built the way that it was built. Coming from my background at Facebook and what I saw in the years that I was there, a lot of people can agree that Facebook is a massively successful company, whatever your perspective is on it. The one thing that was obvious, especially being on the inside. The level of talent that they have was the number one reason that they got to where they could be.

REW Sief Khafagi | Short Term Rentals

Short-Term Rentals: Facebook is a massively successful company. Whatever your perspective is on it.


You look at acquisitions like that they had of Instagram. They bought Instagram for a billion dollars back in the day, and people were like, “That’s a lot of money.” It was one of the first billion-dollar acquisitions of an app, and they took that in 30 exits. Why? It’s because of the talent and the infrastructure that they have. The ethos here is bringing talent together, great talent in the space. We believe we can 50X this space because we are all working towards the same goal.

This is a technical question but when you build a business like this, your individual homes, you buy as single-family homes. Is that true?


When you sell them, you sell them as a business. Do you sell them with a commercial lender or do people buy them with a residential lender? How does that work? I know that’s super nitty-gritty but I’m curious.

The short answer is that you can technically do either. It depends on how much cash you probably want to bring to the table and who’s buying it. I would say, more often than not, you are going to use a commercial product, often known as a DSCR loan or debt service coverage ratio loan. The reason that one is going to be more ideal is that if that property is a truly successful Airbnb, it will likely be worth more than a traditional single-family home that’s based on appraisals and comps.

Traditional single-family is sold based on what the house next door sold, for lack of a better word. If your property is generating all this revenue, it’s going to be worth a multiple of that revenue. Not necessarily what the guy next door sold for. To get proper lending on that, you are going to need to show financials. We would provide those financials to our buyers in the future. They would be able to get lending based on the historical performance of this asset. Therefore, secure lending in a commercial way.

You must have records for at least two years to get any commercial loan on this. Is that true?

You don’t need to. For all of the properties we buy, we use commercial debt. We use DSCR, and it’s not an existing short-term rental 9 times out of 10. There are two ways to do it. You can either underwrite it as a single-family home because our ethos is buying it based on value and selling it based on revenue. It’s very easy to do.

There are several companies out there now that will lend on projected Airbnb revenue. There are tools that they use out there like AirDNA, Rabbu, all the rooms or other analytics and APIs. Alternatively, you can also buy it the traditional residential way and then turn it into an Airbnb. Depending on what income you have. If you have a W-2, you might be able to qualify for a residential loan with better terms. Commercial lending will have higher debt costs. It is what it is in the business world.

It’s easier to qualify in the commercial world because they are not looking at your income. They are looking at, “Is this asset a good investment?” It’s a lot easier to scale. If you are thinking about scale, that’s a great option. If you are looking at buying a single property, you are going to house hack or do half of it in Airbnb, you should consider your options on the W-2 side and what those rates and programs look like.

If you're looking at buying a single property that you're going to house hack or do half of it in Airbnb, you should consider your options on the W2 side and what those rates and programs look like. Share on X

I feel like we could talk forever because I’m interested in this topic but we are running out of time. Sief, why don’t you tell everybody how they can reach you?

If anyone is interested in learning a little bit more about Techvestor or short-term rentals, we often will hold videos, webinars or other content. Follow Taylor on Twitter or on some other social platforms but you can also talk to us. We are at Techvestor.com. You can request to learn a little bit more about what we do, how we do it, and if it’s a good fit for what you are looking for or if you are curious about short-term rentals.

That question on debt is a question that we get quite a bit because people come to us, and they are like, “I want to buy a turnkey short-term rental,” which is another line of our business that we do. They are like, “Can you help me find one for myself? The reason I want it is that I want to use it with my family for two months out of the year. Can you help me with that?” If any questions you have, please reach out to us. We are happy to help you out. We are all about education and educating this space.

I love that. Thank you so much. Ladies, we are going to talk a little bit more about EXTRA on how to pick your markets for short-term rentals, how he does do it, how he specifically uses his software to do that, and all of that stuff. Stay tuned for that. That’s going to be a great conversation. Before we do that, Sief, are you ready for three rapid-fire questions?

I’m ready. Hit me.

Tell us how to get started in real estate investing. Give us a super tip.

Go for it. You are going to make mistakes. The very first property I ever did when I was a young kid, I lost $30,000 in the height of 2008. I stayed away from real estate arguably for the next 7 or 8 years because I was terrified. Don’t be me.

Do as I say, not as I do. I love that. What is one’s strategy to be successful as a real estate investor?

Tell your story. I think stories sell. Oftentimes, the person you are selling is yourself. You have to sometimes understand your why to why what you do and why you do it and why you get up every morning to grind the way that you do. Real estate isn’t easy. It’s a grind, especially in the early years, so you must have a why.

What is one daily practice you do, Sief, that you think contributes to your personal success?

I sit down and talk with my wife. The reason that’s important to me is that I’m a workaholic by trade. Taking 10 or 20 minutes of dissecting and getting away from everything that is the chaos of Airbnb at times, allows me to feel a little bit more grounded in what I’m doing on a daily basis. As a father of 2, especially 2 young boys, it’s important to me to understand my why on a daily basis. Finding time for them is my biggest motivator.

It's essential to understand your WHY daily. Share on X

This has been a great conversation. Thank you for all you’ve shared, Sief.

Thank you for having me, and I appreciate the opportunity.

Ladies, thank you for joining Sief and me for this portion of the show. It was amazing, wasn’t it? I loved it. If you are interested in more, we’ve got more. In EXTRA, We are going to be talking about how he picked his markets, why he picked the mind that he picked and what he look at. If you are subscribed to EXTRA, stay tuned, there’s more.

If you are not but would like to be, go to RealEstateInvestingForWomenEXTRA.com, and you can sign up there. For those of you that are leaving us now, thank you so much for joining us for this portion of the show. I super appreciate you. I look forward to seeing you soon. Until then, remember that goals without action are just dreams. Get out there, take action and create the life your heart deeply desires. I will see you soon. Bye.


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About Sief Khafagi

REW Sief Khafagi | Short Term RentalsSief is the CEO and Cofounder of Techvestor, which acquires and operates STRs (short term rentals) AKA those wonderful things we know as Airbnbs. HNWI, private equity partners, family offices and institutions work with Techvestor to start, scale and grow portfolios in 15+ markets.

Previously, he founded Scoutpads, helping thousands of tech employees diversify into real estate after spending nearly 5 years at Facebook. Collectively, Investors have contributed to acquisitions totaling more than $100M.

In addition, he’s a Young Entrepreneur Council Member sharing strategy and thought leadership on scaling/growing a business.


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From Waitress To Running A $200 Million Dollar Business With Jennifer Wehner

REW Jennifer Wehner | Scaling Your Business


When you’re down, there’s nowhere else to go but up. All it takes is the right mindset! Jennifer Wehner, the CEO and Team Leader of The Wehner Group, joins Moneeka Sawyer and talks about resilience. Jennifer shares her success story, from saving tips to running her $200-million business. She also talks about scaling your business through a channel account. Don’t let the recession keep you from reaching your goals. Time is of the essence! Tune in, get inspired, and find out how you can drown those limiting beliefs, get into the opportunity mindset, and seize the chance to take your business to the next level!

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From Waitress To Running A $200 Million Dollar Business With Jennifer Wehner

Real Estate Investing For Women

I am so excited to welcome Jennifer Wehner to the show. Jenn got into real estate in 2003 as an investor, growing her buyer and investor business, and became the top agent in her office within the first full year of being in real estate. In 2014, she started her team, The Wehner Group, and in 2020 sold 373 homes and over $178 million in real estate volume. In 2021, Jenn hit $198 million in volume. Jenn is a mom of four, ages 5 to 23. She owns multiple businesses and investment properties and is also a Forbes author. She’s a foodie, biohacker, podcast junkie, avid reader, skydiver, and a lifelong learner with a ton of curiosity and a wild imagination. Jenn, welcome to the show. How did you get here? Give us two minutes of your story.

I was built with adversity because I was a teen mom at eighteen. I was going to college for Plan X and I knew I wanted to work for myself. I was in Orange County and I was saving up all my tip money, waiting tables at night, going to college, and getting A’s for business, but I didn’t want to work for the man. I was in California. I did the math. I’m like, “You can buy two homes and own them for the price you rent a house in Huntington Beach.”

I moved here, started flipping, working with investors, invested myself, working with buyers, sellers, and all of the fund gambits. I lost huge in ‘08 but also pivoted quickly, and then started to get back into investing in 2011. I grew in my team. Here I am now. I’m a builder. I love building, I love creating. 2023 will be my 28th year in real estate. I’ve also raised all my kids through real estate.

My daughter bought her house two years ago, my oldest. She’s 25. She has made over $250,000 on her house. I’m like, “We’re going to take a HELOC at it and buy your first house and rent that one out.” I love practicing, seeing my kids being able to do it, and being able to have something where you can leave a legacy and you can leave a mark on the world. There’s no other avenue that I have seen better than real estate, which is the American dream.

That was such a quick impactful story. I love when moms were able to help their children to start and create that same empowering business. I love what you talked about buying your primary residence, getting a HELOC, and buying something else. That’s exactly how I built my business too. Ladies, you’re learning it from somebody other than me. It’s a strategy that works and you can do that alongside the other things that you’re doing. She’s going to college. She’s building her own life. You can do that on the side and build multiple million-dollar businesses starting from this thing that’s not even your business. It’s not even your life. It’s that sort of thing that’s happening because you have to pay rent anyways. I love that.

Talk to me a little bit because since you went through the 2008 thing and so did I, I know that real estate is a roller coaster. How can people get through it? It’s a cycle. I do know that in EXTRA, we’re going to be talking about the resilient mindset. Ladies, we are going to do a deep dive into that. Give us a high level. What do you recommend to investors when they talk about the fear of the rollercoaster?

First of all, if we all got into a DeLorean, we would do a few things differently. I had gotten into real estate at the end of ‘03, so ‘04 was my first full year. It was a good year. In ’05, I put Craigslist ads out and sold homes like it was no one’s business. I bought homes like it was no one’s business. I even built luxury homes, so I got into development. When the market crashed, I had to pivot fast because I had kids to provide for. There was no option. It’s that mindset of when I lost everything. I go back to that because I think no matter where you at, maybe you’ve never lost as much as I have or maybe you’ve lost more, we’ve all gone through adversity or resilience in our life.

REW Jennifer Wehner | Scaling Your Business

Scaling Your Business: No matter where you’re at, maybe you’ve never lost as much or have lost more, but we’ve all gone through adversity or resilience in our life.


During that time, it was millions of dollars below zero. That’s how much I was worth. There was also an opportunity. 2007 was the year that was flat. 2008 was when it blew up. For me, it was the collaboration where I knew I needed help. In 2008, I got into an REO coaching mastermind and started to get REO accounts. I was already working on short sales, but now I was able to get these channel accounts and get them at a much higher volume and scale where I can build from that.

What I want to do is do some definitions of that. Talk about REO and channel accounts, so people understand what we’re talking about.

REO means Real Estate Owned. It’s bank owned. The home went to foreclosure and the bank got the asset back. Here in Arizona, we were extremely affected by the crash. I had read Robert Kiyosaki and I thought I was setting my family up because all the money I was making from real estate, I was putting back into the investment side of things. I didn’t follow his advice totally because we weren’t cashflowing on a lot of those properties. When the market blew up, I was so heavily invested in one thing, which was luxury homes that I could not sell. I owed $1.2 million on each one. Each one ended up being worth $300,000 to $400,000 at the very bottom.

If I had the collaboration that I had now back in ’05, ’06 and ’07, I would have been prepped, ready and primed for the opportunity because I would have seen it coming. When we have to change when change is already here, it’s hard. You’re caught with your pants down. You change before you have to change, and so much of this is just in your mind. When you’re the smartest person in the room, it’s going to be a problem. First of all, get yourself into a room full of smart people that have been where you’re at and where you want to go.

Get into a room full of smart people who have been where you're at and where you want to go. Share on X

It’s not just in terms of money, it’s a skill level that’s super important, but also look at their lifestyle and their character. Is that somebody that you truly aspire to be like? When you’re in a room like that, it’s the energy, focus and direction. I might be able to see myself one pebble step here. I’m a visionary. I put things together like a step here, but maybe with you, I can see the third step and the fourth step. Maybe we bring a group of girls and now I can see a path laid out in front of me.

It’s the resilience I had because it was hard. I’m a recovered alcoholic. I haven’t had a drink of alcohol in four years. When I lost everything in ‘08, there were some times that my alcoholism got bad because I felt very defeated. In that defeat. I remember crying to God and praying for anything to happen. I was able to shift because when you finally admit defeat, you find a way. I found a collaboration group and the REOs. I was able to build channel accounts. When I have a relationship with you, it’s not just one home. You might give me 100 homes or maybe 200 homes

Is that what a channel account is? You build a relationship with a bank. Is that it? What happened?

It could be anybody. It could be a divorce attorney. It could be an HR department. If you’re an investor, maybe it’s a hedge fund. There are so many different channel accounts, but it’s going to be somebody that’s going to be able to give you business over and over again. Maybe it’s somebody that can give you a business of twenty units a year. Maybe it’s somebody that can give you 200 units a year. It’s going to be somebody that is formed through relationship and opportunity. Obviously, you have to sync on what they want, what you’re providing in terms of value, and what your goals are. When you have those aligned and you can provide the best client experience, then that’s what sets you apart. It’s shifting that mindset of not just a growth mindset but specifically an opportunity mindset.

In every down market, that’s when the most millionaires were made. If I had known so much back then, I would have been more like you. In 2009 and 2010, I would have been buying the heck out of the real estate, which I didn’t. We were broke during those years. Luckily, I had REO and short sale and still a resale business. I took every signed call. I was not too good at anything. I was selling $25,000 homes if that’s what it took, but I was able to get to that next level where I could start to build again.

I love that story. What has intrigued me so much is digging deep into that resilience mindset. I’m so excited about EXTRA. It’s like, how did you get there? I also want to hear more about the channel accounts. I’ve never heard it positioned quite that way. We’ll talk about that in EXTRA. I’ve taken note because I want to definitely hear more about that. I love that you gave a story as an example of we are capable of so much. When you go into that place of despair, which I know so many people did in 2008, including myself, it’s what we can do. I was in despair because I had lost 50% of the value of my portfolio in three months. I watched it all go down.

I remember, like you, I was crying. I was huddled up in bed in the fetal position. I was like, “What was I going to do?” I managed to make it through. Part of that was my own positioning. I don’t consider myself a super smart person, but I did some smart things inadvertently with the advice of mentors and my dad that helped me to get through some stuff. I made a lot of sacrifices. As you mentioned, you’re not too good at anything. You make some sacrifices so that you can keep your life going and that sort of thing. I didn’t suffer from the loss. What I want to hear in EXTRA is what that mindset was when you suffered through that despair and the financial loss.

What we’ve learned so much on this show so far is people who got through it and then the strategies they used to get back on top and to get their lives back. I know that you did that. I’m so excited to hear about your mindset stuff in EXTRA. Thank you so much for the lead-in, so we know what to look forward to. You have this interesting term about renaissance real estate. You talk about being a renaissance real estate agent and investor. Could you talk a little bit about what that means to you? I totally agree with you. This is another thing, ladies, that we talked about in the green room. It’s so exciting. Could you share that with us, Jenn?

To backtrack a little bit. I’m writing a book, the Renaissance Real Estate Agent: How to Unleash the Art of Systems in Your Business. I was inspired by my love of Leonardo Da Vinci and the whole Renaissance is fascinating. Here in Phoenix, we have absolutely been in the renaissance. We here now as a nation are absolutely in the renaissance. It’s a new way of doing business. As with the renaissance, so much of this is foundational. It’s back to the basics and back to the long-term foundations because that advice still applies.

You pick up Think and Grow Rich, and it still applies. Pick up Marcus Aurelius from 150 AD, it still applies. Some of these foundational still apply, but what we are also in is a revolution and an evolution of technology. We have systems. It is a lot more competitive. Any time a market changes like it’s changing right now, you have to be like the renaissance masters, who were able to pivot. They collaborated. They weren’t trying to do this all solo.

In that opportunity, where is that opportunity? There’s an art, there’s a science, there’s a balance, but you find your individuality. You find what makes you different and what sets you apart. I have a strong opinion on something that everybody is an artist. When I say that, it’s each one of us has our own gifts. We each sometimes have our own weaknesses, but sometimes those weaknesses can be our gifts. Sometimes that adversity and those problems that come our way are gifts in disguise.

We each have our own gifts and weaknesses, but sometimes, those weaknesses can be our gifts. Share on X

I even think about that with my alcoholism. I’m an addict. Am I doing drugs or drinking? No, but can I be a workaholic? Can I even be addicted to growth? Yes, absolutely. I could be addicted to learning. When you apply the art and science to your own life, into your calendar, and some of those foundational things like living by your calendar, you’re able to set specific measurable goals. You have to have numbers. You have to know if you have met your goal or not. You’re able to apply your own individuality and your own gifts into the marketplace and create value.

That’s what makes you the artist in your business. That’s what makes you an entrepreneur. That’s what branding is. When you look at the whole as far as your legacy, what are you doing this for? Where’s your money? Where’s your work? Where are your friends? When I say balanced, it doesn’t mean I relax. I very rarely relax. The way I live is a more balanced approach to spirituality. When I am in a good spiritual place, I know my limiting beliefs and my fear are not leading me. It’s my inner voice, my gut, and my inner authority. Everybody has that.

Get past the noise of the media. Know that you have to use media for your business. It’s part of the technology evolution that we’re seeing. Use these systems to your advantage, but work into your highest and best use of time. Ultimately, no matter what industry you are in, time is going to be your biggest commodity. I’m 44. Time is fleeting. I am so aware of my time. I know what my dollar per hour is. I know how I’m spending it. I can look at my calendar and see how I’m spending it. I can look at my calendar for the past year. I can look at my calendar all the way up until the end of this quarter or at the fourth quarter and see where I’m at.

No matter what industry you are in, time will be your biggest commodity. Share on X

I know where I’m spending my time to the highest and best use and what makes me different. I think we have 80,000 agents here in Phoenix. How you’re able to get to the top is a lot of Darwinism, but it’s that collaboration and that individuality. If I can give some advice, one of the biggest things that I let be the barrier for me and what I’m actually capable of is what other people think about me. As you get to higher levels, you grow this pack of haters. Sometimes those voices that you hear in your mind like, “You can’t do this. You’re not good enough,” are not even your voices. It’s the voices of the other people that have hated you. They’re jealous because they don’t think they could do it themselves. You have to start to drown out that noise.

There were a couple of things that you said. Both of these two things, I wanted to highlight. Time is our most unsustainable or unreplenishable resource. What I’ve done in the last 50 years, I don’t get back. I don’t get back that time. We can replenish the money. We can replenish relationships, although relationships are going to support your joy. We can replenish a lot of things, but we cannot replenish time. We cannot replenish our health. I love what you said about those two things that we don’t get back. You want to make sure that anything that you do supports the best use of those things and the best development of those things, the time and its use with health as development.

I love that you mentioned that. It’s so key to success to understand what your time is worth. A lot of people like stay-at-home moms are like, “I’m spending all this time with my kids.” Being a mom is the most important job on the planet. It’s worth your time. Just because you’re a mom doesn’t mean that your time is not worth something. Those sorts of things like those paradigms, you need to understand the value of your time, whether it’s financially, in relationships, in health or wherever it is. However you’re using that time, be clear that you’re utilizing it in a way that’s going to support your bliss.

The haters. My show is all about bliss, joy and happiness. I’m always surprised by how many haters I have. You should see reviews on my show where people are like, “She’s too happy. I can’t listen to that voice,” or “She’s so fake. She has no idea what life is about.” People have said this stuff to me my whole life. I’m like, “How can you hate that?” We all have our perspectives. It’s not necessarily even jealousy. Sometimes it is. What I have found is it’s there on their path, and their path is not your path. I can cry because those haters don’t love me but instead focus on the people that I’m impacting and improving their lives with my voice, this voice that they hate.

Love your haters too because sometimes it’s that chip on your shoulder. Anger is the closest thing to passion. Laugh is the best revenge. You can laugh all the way to the bank, but when you are being genuine and living up, only you know that. When you don’t make your commitment for that day and you could even lie to your coach or your team, whatever, “No, I didn’t make those 100 calls,” or whatever it was, but you know. When you start honoring those commitments to yourself, you start to grow not just confidence but self-esteem. I think women sometimes put so many other people first. We don’t put ourselves first.

REW Jennifer Wehner | Scaling Your Business

Scaling Your Business: Love your haters, too, because sometimes it’s that chip on your shoulder that anchors the closest thing to passion. That is the best revenge, and you can laugh all the way to the bank.


Sometimes that’s why we don’t make these commitments to ourselves that we know we should be making. When we talk about health, if I could go a little bit further on that because I’m such a big proponent of it, I have ulcerative colitis, an autoimmune disease. I almost lost my colon in 2015. I had been overweight. I hadn’t been working out past high school. Sometimes you become a mom and work a lot. I also weighed 192 pounds after my last son, and that was after he was out of my body. I still had all that weight to lose. I got into learning more about my health. I will say I’m a junkie when it comes to podcasts and books, but I biohack through diet, exercise and meditation.

I no longer even live with symptoms of my autoimmune disease. I still have my full colon left and I’ve lost all the baby weight plus some. I need to be in good health so that I can be the best mom for my kids. I believe in quality over quantity when it’s my kids. When I’m on with my kids, I’m here. Even if it’s fewer hours, if I have four hours with them a night, those four hours could be like 40.

I don’t feel guilty when I’m working because I know I’m honoring the commitments I’ve made, not just to my business and myself but also to my kids. I’m able to offer them things like let’s take vacations together. They can see through their mom that it’s possible for them in this land of opportunity and freedom in the country that we’re in that allows us to be able to build these multiple businesses, and legacies, and help more people. At the end of the day, that’s what it is. You’re helping more and more people along the way.

I want to sit in that because it’s so true. I feel like I misstepped a little bit when I said that relationships are replaceable. I didn’t mean it the way that it came out. Many of them are not.

Some of them are. Sometimes you do have to cut friends though. It’s not for bad reasons. It might be this person is not growth-oriented. I don’t want to talk about gossip. Sometimes along the way, you’re cutting some relationships to make room for other ones and those ones that are important to you.

Your kids, your spouse or your parents, those sorts of relationships. The other thing that you said about relationships that were so valuable is if you’re the smartest person in the room, you’re never going to grow. For our egos, we want to be the smartest person in the room. What I have found is that if I’m the smartest person in the room, and please don’t take this the wrong way ladies, but I get bored. It’s exhausting because you are carrying everything. I feel it even in this show.

If I’ve got someone where I’ve got to carry the entire show, it’s exhausting on the other end of that. I need a cup of coffee. I’m feeling drained. If I’m talking to people that are significantly smarter than me, and almost every one of my guests is, I don’t ever want to be critical. Everybody has something to offer me. Every single person. You can feel it when someone is elevating you. That’s the thing that I love.

I was talking about this. I have to get away at least once a quarter. That’s pretty much what my travel schedule has been, even though I should be traveling a tiny bit more. I had been sick and I didn’t travel for 3 or 4 months. I was trapped in my own limiting beliefs and the team that I had at that time around. My leadership team is a new leadership team now. It was exhausting. I went to San Diego with my mentors. They had a mastermind. It was refreshing to see that these lies I was telling myself, “I couldn’t do it. This is not possible,” these complaints, this negativity, I go into this room where big things are happening. I am so not the smartest person in the room.

We all had different things to offer. I was so inspired and fueled and energetic that when I came back, I made things happen. I created the new leadership team that I have now that I’m able to now pivot my time from 90% of my team to 10%, and 90% of my network in some other projects like publishing books. It was so integral to get away and not be the smartest person in the room because you don’t even know sometimes these limiting beliefs are limiting beliefs.

Sometimes you don't even know that those limiting beliefs are limiting beliefs until someone else sees them. Share on X

Until someone else sees it or says something completely different. It’s so sweet. I tell this story on my show a lot. I think it’s worth mentioning again here. My little sister, we have this big sister, little sister paradigm like angst. She does not want a big sister. She wants to be the big sister. We have such an interesting thing. She says some things that are so profound and I don’t think she realizes how insightful she can be. I’m always listening when she’s talking.

One day she said something about our nephew that we were talking about. There was something going on. He needed a little surgery. She said, “He’s perfect the way he is as long as we don’t compare him to anybody else.” It was so interesting because I didn’t realize that even I feel like I’m such an unjudgmental person. I was worried about this thing for him, but her saying that shone a light on my own opinions and impressions of what was going on in my mind about this whole thing. It completely released and liberated me to accept him exactly as he was.

I think that’s what happens when you’re in these conversations with people that elevate you. They challenge your thoughts and beliefs. They allow you to release things and liberate yourself so that you can bring in more good stuff. That’s just in my family. It happens in my mastermind all the time. I love that. Our relationships are very important. Speaking of relationships, you talk a lot about legacy, and it’s not just relationships but in lots of different ways. Could you talk to us about leaving a legacy and how to leave it? What’s your perspective on that?

Money is important. People who say, “Money doesn’t buy happiness,” never had money. It’s not just the money. It’s the security. I love to give. I think it’s one of the most selfish things that I do. When I give my money away or my time away to a cause, I feel so good about myself. I don’t have to plaster it all over social media. The more money you have, the more money you can give away. There’s a certain point of money where you can have houses and vacations. Those are all great. Those are all fun to work for, but it’s also more short-term.

REW Jennifer Wehner | Scaling Your Business

Scaling Your Business: People who say money doesn’t buy happiness have never had money. It’s not just the money; it’s security.


The more money you have, the more money you can give away. Share on X

At a certain point, you’re going to get to be at maybe a comfortable place if you don’t live, desire, and want all the time. When you think about the legacy you leave, it’s a why that’s so much bigger than yourself. When you think about what our ancestors went through. Maybe they weren’t your ancestors, just some of the greats in history. You can see what human potential is. What are your great-great-grandchildren going to know of you? Can they know you? To me, that is so much more exciting than the house that I can buy, the second home, and the vacations I can take, but it’s what I can do with the money that I make. It’s the impact.

I feel like a calling in the world right now. I think we all know that the world is not the most stable place, but what can we do to provide more value? When I say value, it’s like energy. You’re putting energy out there into the world through your businesses, through a way for them to make their own value. You’re creating leaders. Leaders create leaders. You’re creating a whole energy movement that maybe you will write a book. There will be a chapter in history about you, but your great-great-grandchildren are going to know what you stood for and know what is possible. More than ever, that imagination and that possibility, that’s where it’s at. That’s where we can find that magic that sometimes we’ve lost along the way since people squashed our childhood dreams.

All the good intentions, but we have to bring them back. I think it’s true. This whole thing about giving back, I talk about it a lot on my show, not to brag but to encourage and for people to understand that money can be a very good thing. It was so interesting. I was talking to my swami who runs a school in India that I have been very supportive of for 30 years since it began. I talk about it a lot. I remember talking to my swami one day and he goes, “If you give this much money, we’ll build a building and put your name on it.” I was like, “That would be horrifying.” I don’t want anybody to know because that’s not why I’m doing it.

Put some other inspirational name that means something on that building. My name doesn’t mean anything to anybody but me. Do you know what I mean? I love that you were talking about you don’t need to splash it around on social media. You don’t need to make a big deal about it. The big deal is what happens in your heart. When you have the money, you can fill your heart up in that way. You can help so many more people on a small level and a big level. Money gives you the freedom of time.

Suddenly you’re not head down, nose down. You’re looking up and seeing in the world what people need and how you can help. It gives you so much more freedom, not just financially but it allows your heart to open because you’ve got the time. You’re not exhausted all the time. You’re not working so hard all the time. You’re now much more open to the world if you allow yourself to be. There are a lot of people that have money and don’t do those things. They’re more about vacations, cars, and how cool I am. When they give, everybody knows about it. It’s that sort of thing.

At what point does it become uninspiring? I’ve never seen a U-Haul follow a hearse. You’re not taking that with you to the other side. When you’re doing it for more than just yourself, you’ll always find a way. I think we’ve all been like if we have an appointment at 10:00, I’m going to be there at 10:00. We’ve all had those, “I’m going to go to the gym at 10:00,” and we don’t go to the gym. When you’re doing it for other people, you’re naturally going to be more inclined to show up in your best way because it’s for them. It’s not just for yourself.

REW Jennifer Wehner | Scaling Your Business

Scaling Your Business: When you’re doing it for other people, you’re naturally going to be more inclined to show up in your best way because it’s for them. It’s not just for yourself.


They say that accountability is the highest form of love. As parents, it’s hard sometimes to have accountability when you want to make them happy, “Here you go. Here’s the money. Here’s the candy,” whatever. When you know that accountability is the highest form of love. It’s that discipline. It’s that sacrifice. Even love itself takes sacrifice. If you say it doesn’t, it’s a one-way road. We know that’s not the way it is with relationships. It’s about both of you. It’s about both needs and wants. Are we aligned? Can we grow and do this together? That’s where the excitement happens, that spark.

I love this conversation. Where can people get in touch with you if they want more?

I am all over YouTube and the website. I would say the best way to instantly get a hold of me is on Instagram, @Jennifer.Wehner. I check my messages regularly. If you DM me, I have coaching products. We have a network. I love to meet other people from other industries. We do a lot of cross-collaboration amongst industries and also stay on top of cutting-edge trends because it changes daily.

Thank you for that. We’re going to go into our three rapid-fire questions, but I want to remind you, ladies, what we’re going to be talking about in EXTRA. We’re going to talk about creating a resilient mindset and also channel accounts and how you develop those relationships. I’m super excited about that. Are you for our three rapid-fire questions?

Let’s go.

Tell us one super tip on getting started investing in real estate.

I’m going to go to a foundational. Begin with a long game in mind and have a plan. I don’t know wherever you’re starting out. You might have $10,000 saved up. You might have $20,000 saved up. No matter where you are, look at where you’re at and what you’re going to need. That’s going to be that plan. I always suggest either a coach or a collaboration group somewhere. You need to have somewhere you’re going to learn and gain energy from and stay relevant.

Learn the basics and that skill. Learn the expertise that you need. Find your mentor, find your tribe, get your plan in place, and begin with that long game in mind. If it’s shortsighted like, “I’m trying to make $1 million this year and then I don’t know about the next year,” no. Think about where you want to be in 5, 10, 20 and 30 years, and then you’re going to look at the first year. That would be my advice. It’s pretty generic. It’s one of those foundational things that you need to have in place before you can start building the skyscraper.

Find your mentor and tribe, get your plan in place, and begin with that long game in mind. Share on X

What would you say is a strategy for being successful as a real estate investor?

I would tap maybe your wrist here and see if you’re feeling too comfortable. If you are comfortable, chances are you’re not playing the game. Sometimes you have to get out of your way to see the way. Stop and take a moment. Look at where you’re at. Are you on pace with your goals? Are your goals too small? Are you off your goals? Can you increase those goals? Success is like there’s never going to get to the top of the mountain. Nobody reaches the top of the mountain. We all die. Hopefully, we’re going up the mountain, not down. Always keep thinking big.

I use Albert Einstein’s quotes a lot and I love him. He said, “Logic will take you from A to Z. Imagination will take you everywhere.” I do have something called the spiritual wheel. I calendar block this. I do my spiritual wheel exercise every six months or so and see how balanced I am and how much I give myself in the spiritual box, friendship box, money box, work box, and self-care box. Sometimes if I’m lacking in one area, I can pivot that.

Let’s say it’s self-care. I took a painting for example. Now I have every Sunday time blocked for the morning time, so I can paint with my mentor. This is the thing I did because when I looked at my self-care, it was pretty low. I know I needed to do things for myself beyond just going to the gym. When we say successful, are we really successful? Are we happy? Are we comfortable? Where are we going? Where are we at and where are we going? Repause, reflect, revision, recast, and then take action.

What would you say is one daily practice that you use that contributes to your personal success?

I think we do talk a lot about AM routines, but I don’t think we talk enough about PM routines. The PM routines are so important. As a biohacker, I’ve done my PM routines accurately with my Oura ring. For me, no blue light before bed. Look at your calendar. Did you meet all your requirements? Reflect on your day. If you have things in your calendar you didn’t do like prospecting, take it out, put what you did, and then have your plan for tomorrow. Give yourself your win. Have that reflection time and then you could empty your brain out. You’re not trying to go to bed at 10:00 and you’re trying to think about what you were supposed to do.

REW Jennifer Wehner | Scaling Your Business

Scaling Your Business: Give yourself your win, so you have that reflection time, and then you can empty your brain out.


No blue light for two hours before bed. I know it’s a sacrifice, but no Netflix and you fall asleep to it. For me, that could be a walk at night. That could be having dinner and exchange. One night, I’m reading this wonderful book, The Motivation Manifesto. I read that an hour before bed. It’s what I am putting into my brain before I go to sleep because who knows where we go when we sleep, but it’s so important we’re waking up. One of the things they say when you start bodybuilding, because that’s what I do, is make sure you sleep first. Why do you start with your sleep first? It’s because it’s all about our energy. Energy is everything.

In those PM routines, building a solid PM routine. Even if you’re at a conference, maybe it’s twenty minutes where you have that wind-down time, that reflection, and that meditation. If you have a hard time meditating because you’re an entrepreneur, I’m going to give you a little biohack here. There are a lot of apps that do it like Breathe and Calm. I like Frequency. You can get the sleep mask, because you want to sleep as dark as you can, with headsets built into it. It’s very comfortable.

I put my Frequency music in so my brain is being trained all night to whatever frequency I need. If it’s insomnia or if it’s delta, I get to pick. It’s those PM routines that help me wake up excited. Even if you don’t feel excited, your energy levels are already amped up. I don’t know if you’ve had a bad night of sleep, but if you stack those, you’re not your best self. You’re not waking up with the clear focused energy that you need to have to attack your day.

I love that you talk about that because we do talk a lot about the AM routine. Even I do, but I have a very distinctive bliss-focused PM routine also that helps me to sleep well. I’m not turning on what I did not get done or should I, and all these things that we turn about. What did I not get done? Should I have said that to that person? All of those things happen in our minds. Having a good strong PM routine is so important. Thank you so much for sharing that. This has been amazing and I’m so excited to talk more in EXTRA. Thank you so much for what you’ve shared in this part of the show.

Thank you. It was an honor to meet you and I’ve learned to replenish. I was taking notes. Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it.

Ladies, we are going to do more in EXTRA. We’re going to be talking about creating a resilient mindset. We’re also going to be talking about how to build channel accounts and what those are. If you are subscribed, stay tuned. We’ve got more. If you’re not but would like to be, go to RealEstateInvestingForWomenEXTRA.com. For those of you that are not going to be joining us any further but are leaving us now, thank you so much for joining Jenn and me for this portion of the show. I look forward to seeing you next time. Until then, remember, goals without action are just dreams. Get out there, take action, and create the life your heart deeply desires. I’ll see you soon.


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About Jennifer Wehner

REW Jennifer Wehner | Scaling Your BusinessIn Real Estate since 2003, Jennifer has helped hundreds of buyers, sellers, and investors achieve their real estate goals. Placing in the Top 10 agents in the Arizona Regional MLS, and top 100 Zillow Agents nationwide, Jennifer has a passion for providing excellent customer service. Our #1 Goal is to meet or exceed the expectations of our clients. Jennifer has a large team of full-time, licensed professionals, and assists in resale, new homes, land, and investment properties in Maricopa County, Prescott, Flagstaff and Orlando, FL.



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Sallie Wagner: Increasing Your Real Estate Investments With Physical, Mental, And Social Resilience – Real Estate Women

REW Sallie | Real Estate Investments


Mindset is everything. It is one of the ingredients that draws success. In today’s episode, Sallie Wagner, a number one international bestselling author, shares the tools she used to increase her real estate investments. Without taking action with the right mindset and skillset, we wouldn’t be able to reach our path to success. In this conversation, Sallie shares that social resilience is the driving factor in building your network and an outlet to ask for help or to provide help when needed. If you wish to increase your real estate investments, tune in now to this episode and learn more from Sallie!

Watch the episode here


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Sallie Wagner: Increasing Your Real Estate Investments With Physical, Mental, And Social Resilience – Real Estate Women

Real Estate Investing For Women

I am excited to welcome to the show, Sallie Wagner. She is a number one international bestselling author, lawyer, real estate broker, speaker, and life alchemist. She provides broker and contracts compliance consulting services to 2,500 plus real estate agents throughout Florida. She also owns and operates a real estate school. Her powerful transformation tools include the Emotional Freedom Technique, which you guys have heard EFT, and Neuro-Linguistic Programming, NLP, clients move into action for rapid concrete results. Clients reclaim conscious choices in their lives and discover and live the life that makes them come alive. Welcome to the show, Sallie. How are you?

I’m fabulous. Thank you so much for having me.

I have been looking forward to this show. I love my mindset shows, and the strategy shows are important but I’m all about the mindset with the Blissful Investor thing. Could you give us a high-level version of how you got to where you are? Why are you doing real estate, and why are you taking this angle?

I spent most of my career in the corporate world positions like general counsel, house counsel, and those things primarily real estate related. I worked for big corporations managing and working on real estate transactions. I have always been involved in real estate throughout my decades, long career, longer than I care to admit. When I looked at going out on my own, it was natural that I would start doing something in real estate. That’s how I started my own business providing compliance services to real estate brokerages. I teamed up with my colleague now. We do broker and compliance services to brokerages throughout Florida.

Talk to us a little bit about why you chose mindset as the thing that you want to talk about now. I know how important it is. Why is that your highlight?

Everything comes from that. Bob Proctor said, “It’s 95% mindset and 5% what you do.” It all starts with a mindset. When you think about it, it makes sense because mindset includes the stories we tell ourselves about ourselves. We have this constant chatter. What are the things you are telling yourself? Are they things about, “I’m successful, productive, and powerful? I can be in business on my own,” or is it the snarky six-year-old who is going, “What are you smoking? What are you thinking about?” You wish you could do all those things. It all starts with a mindset.

If I may, I do a lot with critical thinking, and there’s a progression. It will sound familiar to people, I’m sure but thoughts determine feelings, feelings determine decisions, decisions determine actions, actions determine results, and results reinforce those thoughts. Everything starts with thoughts. Everything starts with a mindset.

Thoughts determine feelings; feelings determine decisions; decisions determine actions; actions determine results; and results reinforce those thoughts. So everything starts with thoughts. Everything starts with a mindset. Share on X

I was having a conversation with a woman. We are starting to invest in some different things. My husband handles the stock portfolio. I handle the real estate portfolio but I’m interested in some other explorations now. There are many new opportunities. I want to discover all this stuff. I’m talking to this one woman about some of this stuff, and she has a mastermind that they have developed. It’s three women. One of the women is very wealthy. She was like, “I will put $400,000 into this investment.” It makes me choke. I can’t imagine putting $400,000 into anything that’s not real estate. Anything that’s liquid but that’s silliness too.

She was funny because she said, “Hanging out with this woman, my mind has completely changed. I look at things in a different way and make quicker decisions. I have a lot more confidence in my decisions, and I’m not derailed by people around me that are telling me that it’s not going to work or they are expressing all of their fears and projecting those onto me in my decision-making process.”

I was proud of her. There were two big things that I took away from that. I didn’t need to share with her. She was doing a great job but those two things that I loved were understanding that your mindset is going to determine your success for all of the reasons that you said. The second thing is that your mindset will evolve based on the people that you hang out with. Much of the time, people out there are scared of real estate, the stock market, and all these other things because they don’t know, and that’s fair.

It’s because they are scared, it does not mean that when they share their fear and impose that on you or project it on you, you have to take that on. You need to be around people that are going to uplift your mindset and support your goals. If there are people that are where you want to be, and they say, “That’s not a good idea,” that’s the person you listen to. You want to listen to your mentors, coaches, and people that are successful in the industry that you are looking to be successful in. In general, most of us don’t understand.

I experience fear around crypto, NFTs, and all these words that I don’t understand but because I understand that I don’t want other people projecting their fear onto me, I’m careful not to project my fear around those things onto people that are successful at that or starting out in that. My only suggestion is to make sure that your mentor, where you are learning, is someone who is where you want to be. They have experienced success over the long-term.

Even crypto has been around for several years. People can have gone through cycles and experienced the roller coaster that Bitcoin is. Whatever it is that you are investing in, don’t take on there. Hang out with the right people but your mindset is the first place because if you are not in the right mindset, those people are not going to want to hang out with you.

Isn’t that true? If you were, “I’m scared. I don’t want to do it. I can’t take action. This won’t work,” and all those things. Those people don’t want to hang out with you because you pull them down. We always want to hang out with people who are our equals or our peers and learn from one another. The one thing that you do not want to be bringing to the table is negativity.

I hijacked that but that’s why I’m excited about this conversation. Not only because it’s you, Sallie, and I’m excited to talk to you but I had this conversation and saw the level of success that is created by managing that mindset. Talk to me about some of the tools that you use. We are going to be talking about the tools of the business but the tools that you use for your mindset.

I use the acronym M*S*G, Mindset, Skillset, Get Off Your Asset. It gets a chuckle. It’s memorable and brings together some important principles. As important as mindset is, most of us are not taught to have that right mindset. If anything, we are taught not to because, as you said, we have all these messages from people around us. We are constantly bombarded with society, family, and friends. Most of them are all well-meaning, and yet, it changes our mindset to one that is suboptimal.

We're constantly bombarded by society, family, and friends, which changes our mindset to suboptimal. To have that mindset, many times, we need a new skill set. We need to learn skills about how we identify mindset. How do we change it? Share on X

To have that mindset, many times, we need a new skillset. We need to learn skills about how we identify mindset. How do we change it? How do we maintain it? How do we make sure we are in the room with the right people? If you are in a room and you are the smartest, prettiest, funniest, and most successful, you are probably in the wrong room.

It feels super good. It’s a great ego boost. You will learn in every room. I don’t want to say you are not going to learn but you are going to be elevated if you are in a different room.

That’s part of the skillset to learn that and to listen to those mentors and people who are where you are planning to be because it is a plan and goal. You are going to get there. It’s a strategy. It’s not hope. It’s not wishing people who are where you are going. Those are the people you want to be around. You want to cultivate that mindset of openness to be able to receive that information instead of being close and going, “I know that. I have tried and done that. It didn’t work.” How many people do we hear like that? That’s a skillset.

I want to go back to that, Sallie. That is super important. I want to highlight it. Many of you ladies have heard this stuff before. You have even read it on my show before. There’s nothing new under the sun, ladies. It’s all said in different ways. There are new techniques that are altered, adjusted, and brought to the market and in our minds.

We have EFT on this show a lot. People were like, “I heard that on Moneeka’s show,” and then they will tune out. The thing is that if you are hearing it from a different voice, other things may click with you. The last EFT person that was on the show was in 2021, and she did a process for us. Maybe that didn’t work for you but you are a different person now than you were before. Your response to that technique may be different or maybe Sallie does it a little bit differently because there are different ways, and everybody puts their own personality into the process. That’s for the healer as well as for the recipient.

I know you, ladies, are respectful and great but don’t tune out because you have heard this before. Stay fully engaged and present. The other thing is that because you’ve heard something doesn’t mean it doesn’t work. If you have tried it, you are in a different place now. If you haven’t tried it and you’ve just heard it over and over again, you might consider trying it because nothing happens unless you take action.

I want to highlight that because I have heard it before, and I’m guilty of this all the time too. We have so much stuff coming into our minds and our worlds. The, “I have read it,” is a protection mechanism. When you are listening to somebody that you respect, put the I have read it aside and come with a beginner’s mind.

I’m holding my hands up. Studies show that when you hold your hands up, your mind is more open. You are more receptive to learning. You are better able to learn and retain information. Be open to knowledge from wherever it comes.

REW Sallie | Real Estate Investments

Real Estate Investments: Be open to knowledge from wherever it comes.


Ladies, you can go to BlissfulInvestor.com, so you can see how she was holding her hands. That was beautiful. Go ahead and keep going.

Skillset, and we have to put it into action. If we don’t take action, nothing happens, and nothing changes. That is an important skill to be able to take action because we have that tendency to procrastinate. We all do it. I have written articles on procrastination and how to overcome it. It’s a skill that we have learned to cope with certain things. Taking action is a skill that we can also learn to overcome that procrastination. It all goes back to the skillset and the mindset. That allows us to take action and put everything into practice. Otherwise, it’s a picture on the vision board.

REW Sallie | Real Estate Investments

Real Estate Investments: Taking action is a skill. We need to learn to overcome procrastination.


Part of the skill is learning to be decisive. It’s learning to trust yourself. Could you talk a little bit more about some of the skills that helped to build that mindset?

Anything that is resilience related. I speak a lot about resilience. It’s such an important thing, and resilience is M*S*G in practice. Four major areas of resilience in our lives, physical, emotional, mental, and social, all come together. As you build physical resilience, your body is more capable. You are better able to withstand the challenges that come to you if it’s stress, illness, injury or whatever it is.

There are specific ways to build that with physical activity. If you are sitting for more than an hour, studies show that your body is going to deteriorate. When you are coming up on the hour mark, stand up, move around, take a couple of steps, do something, get into physical activity, avoid negative substances, and binge-restrict behaviors.

The negative substances are not always about alcohol and drugs. It could be caffeine, gluten or whatever. It is harmful to me personally. Binge restrict is not always about eating and drinking. It could be that streaming service, all those things. Emotional resilience is our ability to access our positive emotions when we choose. That’s a mindset. We don’t get caught in those low-frequency emotions but can choose to respond rather than react to life events.

We have mental resilience. This is our ability to come up with systems and processes that have a different perspective mindset. Access our creativity, come up with creative solutions and consider different people’s perspectives on things that are opening our minds to mentors and knowledge. The last one is social resilience, which is our community. Our ability to ask for and give help to others, families, friends, neighbors or everyone in our community. Studies show that the more connected you are to your community, the more successful you are likely to be. All those things that can build resilience are important in life and business.

Could you talk to me a little bit about social resilience and what you mean by people being more successful based on social resilience?

Social resilience is our ability to connect with others, family, friends, society, communities, and groups that we are members of and the ability to know that there is somebody there when you need help, you can ask for help, and they will give it to you like a trusted mentor, for example. That’s social resilience. The ability to give help in return. The more connected we are socially, studies show that we tend to be more successful in life and business because we have those networks of people we can call upon. Here is a fun thing. People can build a little bit of social resilience. The next time you have a chance, shake hands with somebody. As you do that, tell them, “Thank you.”

I always refer to studies, and studies can say anything. However, the studies show that when we do that, the touch and the expression of gratitude, we produce a hit of oxytocin in our brains, which is the trust hormone. That makes it more likely for us to want to help and support each other in business, life, and whatever ways. The more we do that, the more we deepen that oxytocin trust bond and self-serving. That’s a fabulous time to ask somebody for a referral because you have already softened them up with oxytocin.

It has been such a fascinating thing over the pandemic over the last couple of years how our communities have changed dramatically. We spend more of our time on Zoom and less of our time touching one another and saying, “Hello.” Even when we see each other and are in each other’s energy space, we don’t touch each other.

We have changed the way that we socialize. Some of it’s certainly going to stick. I couldn’t have this interview with you, Sallie, if it weren’t for amazing Zoom. I love that. I think that our communities and having that physical, at least being in people’s energy space, are important. One of the big keys here that you mentioned, and I want to highlight it, does still need to be the right people. That does not mean you don’t hang out with your friends or family. The people that you love certainly have a place in your life and should. It should be valued, loved, and cherished.

When you are thinking about progressing in your business, you also need to have a community that supports that evolution, growth, expansion, open mind, new ideas, and lots of opportunities. You need that community to support you in that way, also. Much of the time, we are social resilience, and we focus on our personal life, like, “I need support because my parents are elderly. I need support because someone I love passed. I got something that I’m dealing with,” whatever it is.

I’m not good at asking for help. I’m getting better, and there’s a receiving it without feeling guilty. Those are all skillsets too. We are used to it in our personal lives. We tend not to want to do it in our business lives because, as women, we feel like it makes us look stupid. The problem is that if you are afraid of looking stupid, you are going to look stupid because you are not learning. You don’t know what you are doing. You are pretending that you are something that you are not. People can see right through that. Did you have anything you wanted to add to that?

I have experienced that myself, and for me, it was perfectionism. That mindset of, “I have to be perfect. If I ask somebody something, that shows I’m not perfect.” We miss out on many opportunities because of our mindset. I’m not perfect. More importantly, I don’t have to be. Something to remember here is that it’s not what you don’t know that holds you back. It’s what you do know that’s not true that holds you back. The idea that I have to be perfect is something that is not true that holds me back in business and life. When we can identify those things, and that’s all part of our mindset, then we are open to asking and receiving.

It's not what you don't know that holds you back. What you do know is not true – that’s what holds you back. Share on X

My little sister once said about my nephew because everybody was saying, “There was some stuff going on with him.” My little sister said, “He’s perfect just the way he is as long as you don’t compare him to other people.” That is something I take with me so much of the time because I’m like, “I don’t know this. I don’t want to look dumb. I don’t want to ask too many questions.”

It is about perfectionism because I remind myself, “You are perfect the way you are, as long as you don’t compare yourself to other people.” Allow yourself to be who you are because who you are now is you are heading to the next place. There are going to be people that are going to be delighted to help you get there.

Unless you ask questions, you are not going to know if you are hanging out with the right people because there are going to be people that are going to judge you and get snarky. Don’t hang out with them. Thank goodness you didn’t find that out after several years of investing in that relationship. Find out fast. If they are not going to tolerate your questions, curiosity, personality, and goals, they are not that person that’s going to help to elevate you.

That is another thing that brings up one of those things that we know that’s not true. Everybody has to like us, so we have to like everybody else. I’m not saying to treat people disrespectfully. However, it’s okay if you don’t want to be around certain people and they don’t want to be around you. Find the people who are supporting you in your goals, accomplishments, and vision of where you are going in life. That’s okay. Not everybody is going to be there.

Not only is it okay. It is preferred. We only got 24 hours in a day. You only have a certain amount of time to be social. Make sure it counts. Make sure it is fun and good for you. Make sure it is one of your bliss things, not one of your obligatory things. We only got so much to give. You want to make sure that when you are giving, you are also being nourished, elevated, and all of those things.

Maybe it’s me but I had similar conversations. It was such an epiphany when suddenly, it was like, “Not everybody has to like me and I’m okay.”

I’m a people pleaser too. I will be like, “The person didn’t like me.” Now, I give it about five minutes, and then I’m done. It doesn’t matter. I allow myself if I’m feeling sad or definitively if I did not have a connection with that person. It felt a little bit bad but then I realized, “That person that I didn’t have an affinity with if I tried to build that relationship, how many phone calls, emails, and time would it take to build a relationship with that I don’t have an affinity with and how much pressure and work?” If it was a fun person we were aligned with, then we enjoyed spending time together. This show is all about taking action. Let’s talk about taking action and creating a plan for building that mindset to achieve certain goals.

There are three things you want to consider with mindset, perspective, reason, and will. With perspective, we have talked about this before. It’s our ability to view things from other perspectives. We all probably remember the story of the blind men and the elephant. Each of them experienced the elephant in a different way, with trunk, tail, and tusks, and they defined it in a different way based on their perspective.

REW Sallie | Real Estate Investments

Real Estate Investments: There are three things you want to consider with mindset: perspective, reason, and will.


Could you tell us that story? I haven’t heard that one.

There were 9 or 10 men who were experiencing the elephant. One person had a trunk, a tusk, a tail, and an ear. They were all talking about, “What was the elephant? Describe it.” They all described it differently because they had all experienced a different part of the elephant. They were all right because there was the tail. That is what it felt like but they were all wrong because their perspective was incomplete. The truth is that our perspective is always incomplete.

Depending on what our perspective is, it’s either going to move you forward or hold you back. Be aware that we tend to have blinders on. That is partly because of our training and how our brains work with the reticular activating system. We see what we are looking for. We don’t see what we are not looking for. If you can open that up and take those blinders off, you broaden your perspective. That’s all part of the mindset. Become aware of that.

The easiest entry point into mindset is to look at the results you have in your life. If you are happy with those results, perfect. Do more of what you are doing. If there is a result that you are not quite happy with, then the easiest entry point to change that is to look at your thinking about that and change your thinking. All of that, and perhaps the answer as you change your thinking, is to have a different perspective. In LP, we call that reframing. Everybody heard about reframing. Tell yourself a different story, and you are going to get a different result.

REW Sallie | Real Estate Investments

Real Estate Investments: As you change, your thinking is to have a different perspective.


It’s funny because I will frequently say, “You are always making up stories. Everything that goes up in your mind, you are making up.” It’s your story. You might as well make up stories that make you feel blissful. Is it stories that make you feel bad?

I have a perfect example if you don’t mind. Years ago, I was with a successful real estate agent in this area, and she was doing some lead-gen cold calls. She was starting to make a call. She said, “I’m going to call up my friend, Bob.” I’m making up a name. I’m like, “She knows Bob.” She called him up, and he hung up on her. It was a cold call. She didn’t know this person. I thought from the way she approached it. It was her friend because that is the way she approached it. That was the story she was telling herself about Bob.

When he hung up on her, she was like, “We got disconnected.” I’m like, “Are you stupid? He hung up on you. You didn’t get disconnected.” She called him back and was like, “We got disconnected for some reason. I’m sorry.” She tried to talk to him again. He hangs up on her. She was like, “We got disconnected again. He needs a smile. I’m going to ask an agent on her team. I’m going to ask her to go and see him at his house and give him a smile because he needs somebody to make him smile.” That’s the perspective. That’s the story she was telling herself about. She was there to contact her friend, and if her friend was not happy to hear from her, he needed somebody to help him smile. Those are the stories that we can tell ourselves to change our results.

I love that you and I are mindset people, and we are both like, “What?” It’s funny because it sounds hokey. Those of us grounded in reality know what’s going on but does that help us? I don’t want to have fun doing cold calls. I would probably have a lot more fun if I had her attitude. The reality is that we create the story in our heads. We have the story. We create the reality for ourselves. We are not necessarily creating the reality for the world around us. Although many times we are because people take on our energy and start to experience life differently when they are around but you are experiencing your own personal response to any given situation.

That’s the emotional resilience to be able to tap into those positive emotions when we choose so that we are responding rather than reacting.

Emotional resilience is being able to tap into positive emotions when we choose so that we can respond rather than react. Share on X

Let’s talk about developing the action steps to achieve specific goals.

That is important because it is not only the goals. It’s the system and the process because goals can be overwhelming and intimidating. We look at the goal and think, “How am I ever going to get there?” It’s all about reverse engineering goal setting to the present. You ask yourself, and people will recognize this, “What is the one thing I can do that will move me in the direction of that goal?” I break it down into daily steps that will move me in the right direction every single day. It’s important to do that because if we’re focused on the goal, we’re living in a constant state of failure. I’m only successful when I get to the goal.

I’m going to lose 20 pounds. If I have only lost 19 pounds, I’m still a failure because I haven’t met the goal but if my goal is to improve my health and nutrition, and I’m doing things every single day, I’m successful every single day because I’m moving in the right direction. Systems and processes over the goals always. Break it down into daily steps. “What am I going to do now that will continue to move me in the right direction?”

That may change from day-to-day because we are going to course correct. It’s not always a straight line to that goal. The NASA Apollo moon projects were off course 97% of the time and made it to the moon and back. It was because of that constant course correction. We are always going to be adjusting and correcting our course from day-to-day, and yet, we are still moving in the right direction.

One way that you can launch into action is, first of all, to write your goal and your steps down. When you do that, you increase your chances of success to 56%. There are only three steps. The next step is to share that goal with somebody. You have an accountability partner. Maybe it’s your mentor, a coach or whomever but it’s an accountability partner because we can’t hold ourselves accountable. We have to have somebody else do it. When you do that and come up with those daily action steps, you increase your chances of success to 64%.

The accountability partner should not be someone who is going to be supportive all the time. What I mean by this is that you should be embarrassed if you report that you didn’t achieve your goal. Not like so much that you don’t want to show up or get the response from the other person that you don’t like them anymore. I do think that it’s important that you should be embarrassed with your accountability partner to say, “I didn’t do it.”

You should feel like you have to explain why and what your plan is to catch up. Your accountability partner is not your best buddy where you were both like, “I didn’t lose anything last week.” “I didn’t lose anything last week, either.” We might as well get a milkshake. I had those accountability partners. I’m telling you, it has the opposite effect.

It’s a weird thing because I have these in my life. It’s not that you want to do it for them. Somehow there is something about that relationship that inspires you to be the best you. That is why you do it. Not to please them but to honor yourself. If that makes sense.

You should value their opinion enough that if they say something that’s hard to hear, you are able to step back and not get all flustered, offended or defensive. You are able to say, “Maybe they have a point. Let me think about that.”

You need to be willing to listen with open hands. Listen so that you are receptive to the learning and without being defensive that you are going to go, “What do they know?” The third piece is to make progress reports back to that accountability partner, which is what you were saying. At least once a week, you are reporting back on your progress over the past week because accountability is key, and the progress report is key. When you do that, you increase your chances of success up to 76%.

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I want to say that this isn’t hocus-pocus. If you know anybody in corporate, what have they instilled? It’s the agile program. They got two-week sprints. At the end of those two weeks on their deadline, they have to report to everybody what they achieved, how they had the course correct, what didn’t work, and what did work. If now you found that that system that you guys were all working on isn’t working, you have to course correct completely new products and new features.

The whole agile framework is about accountability. That’s all it is. They know that they got a two-week window to achieve a certain number of goals. They are given, discussed or created those goals all for themselves and have a whole accountability meeting to figure out what’s next. It’s done in corporate all the time. I haven’t yet met anybody in the last several years that is not on some version of the agile format. It’s because we may not be in corporate, and we may not have that experience. You have to create it for yourself. With agile, they do a two-week thing. Sallie is recommending one week. You need to find what works well for you. 1 month or 3 weeks is usually not going to work.

It takes too long in between reports because it is easy not to do it. You think, “I got a whole month before I have to do it.” It never happens. You are setting yourself up not to succeed there.

This has been good. Thank you so much.

It’s a pleasure.

Ladies, we have a surprise for you in EXTRA. Sallie, who’s an NLP master, is going to give us a process. She calls it the Ring of Power, which is stacking anchors so that you can choose different states. We call it in NLP states. A state is like confidence, passion, calm, self-reliance, and joy. There are lots of different states, and you can use these states for different things. I have different Rings of Power for when I’m going on a date with my husband, making cold calls, sitting at my desk, speaking or doing a show.

You can create these different rings that you can hold at different times so that you can use them in your life. We never had anybody do it for you ladies on this show. It’s a tool that I use all the time, every day. I got many of them. I’m super excited that she is going to be sharing that with you. It will be a useful tool. I’m excited that Sallie has been generous enough to offer that in EXTRA. Thank you for that.

It’s a pleasure.

Sallie, could you tell them a little bit about your free gift?

It is an eBook. It is entitled, Reboot Your Thinking With M*S*G. We have already talked about what M*S*G is. Reboot Your Thinking is a signature coaching program that I develop. This is a little taste of what that is. As we develop the mindset, skillset, and action, we must reboot how we think.

REW Sallie | Real Estate Investments

A Quick Guide to REBOOT Your Thinking With MSG

M*S*G is Mindset, Skillset, and Get Off Your Asset. I love that. The URL to go to get this free eBook is BlissfulInvestor.com/reboot. Thank you for that. Are you ready for three rapid-fire questions, Sallie?

I am.

Give us one super tip on getting started investing in real estate.

Start small, and figure out what the market is before you get started.

What is one strategy for being successful as a real estate investor?

Continue to stay knowledgeable about what is going on. Understand the basics and things change, particularly in the area of Fair Housing, which can be very problematic for people.

What specifically are you referring to there?

For a lot of property managers, at least in this area, there are testers in the area, and they are being hit with claims of Fair Housing violations for various reasons. For example, it could be with screening for criminal background checks, service animals, emotional support animals or familial status. Those are the hot-button items that I’m seeing a lot of.

What is one daily practice you do, Sallie, that contributes to your personal success?

It is all around building resilience. I find ways to build resilience in those four areas, physical, emotional, mental, and social, every single day.

Ladies, thank you so much for joining Sallie and me for this portion of this show. If you are subscribed to EXTRA, stay tuned. We got more. We are going to be doing a Ring of Power Process so that you can be powerful in whatever you are doing in your day or business. Stay tuned for that. If you are not subscribed to EXTRA but would like to be, go to RealEstateInvestingForWomenExtra.com, and you can check it out there.

For those of you that are leaving Sallie and me now, thank you so much for joining us, and thank you for all that you are doing in your life and for continuing to stick with me. I love you, ladies. I’m looking forward to seeing you next time. Until then, remember goals without action are dreams. Get out there, take action and create the life your heart deeply desires. I will talk to you soon. Bye.


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You’re ALWAYS In The Driver’s Seat: 3 Keys To Unlock Your Power With Karen Abrams

REW Karen Abrams | Unlock Your Power


You have to avoid blaming others for what’s happening in your life because you’re always in the driver’s seat. It’s time to unlock your power and reclaim the life you desire and deserve. Listen to Moneeka Sawyer as she talks with Karen Abrams about unlocking your power and focusing on lightness and joy. Change is within you. What’s important is learning how to adapt, build resilience, and overcome challenges to embrace those changes. In this episode, Karen shares in-depth insights on believing in yourself while taking responsibility for the outcomes you’re experiencing. Tune in to learn more about confidence, self-worth, and shifting your beliefs.

Watch the episode here


Listen to the podcast here


You’re ALWAYS In The Driver’s Seat: 3 Keys To Unlock Your Power With Karen Abrams

Real Estate Investing For Women

I am so excited to welcome to the show, Karen Abrams. Karen is a UCLA Educated Entrepreneur, Master Theta Healer, gifted intuitive, and international bestselling author. For many years, she has helped entrepreneurs and professionals with self-sabotaging habits to gain confidence, financial security, and personal fulfillment.

Karen works with clients worldwide to transform their subconscious beliefs and break free from trapped emotions, traumas, and limiting mindsets to build the financial and personal success they desire and deserve. She is known for integrating her energetic work with practical tools to bring about powerful results. Karen’s keen sense of humor, insights, and healing abilities have made her a rising star on radio, podcasts, and the international telesummit circuit in the Human Potential Movement. Karen, welcome to the show.

It’s so great to be back.

It’s so nice to see you. I met Karen in 2018 before the pandemic, and we’ve been keeping in touch. She did some sessions for me because I am a huge advocate of theta healing, and I learned it myself as a healer several years ago. I’ve been practicing my version of theta healing. I was so excited to see Karen’s focus and the way that she does it. She does it very differently than I do, which is awesome. It was healing for me because I got a completely different perspective on that. She was phenomenal. I wanted to share her with you. Karen, thanks for coming by to talk to my audience and share all your amazing wisdom.

Thank you so much. I’m so happy to be back in your happy space.

Thank you. Karen, let’s start by how did you become a healer. Give us the high-level version.

I watched a friend of mine change all of these major areas of her life with theta healing. I wanted to give you a background on her to know what was going on so you can relate to it. She’s a brilliant woman. She had a business degree from a great Ivy League school. She had big health issues that were very difficult for her to resolve. She had a long-term relationship that wasn’t going where she wanted it to go. She wasn’t making the money that she knew that she could.

She had a lot of self-sabotaging issues going on with her, like getting in fights with clients and her boss and all these things. Her friends were making $400,000 a year, and she was a fraction of that. She wasn’t able to turn it around by herself. She started working with the founder Vianna Stibal, who’s the Founder of ThetaHealing. I saw over a relatively short period of time that all of the areas of her life started to change in a big way. Her health got so much better. Her relationship transformed into the loving friendship that it was meant to be. She then started making money.

I went, “That’s interesting,” because that was an area that I was having a challenge with. When something like this work shows up so conventionally in somebody’s life, my antennas are like going, “What is that?” Vianna came out and did a beginning theta healing class. I love the class. I loved how she worked with the toughest people in the room. They changed in minutes with tough issues they were doing and looked years younger afterward.

Take a hundred percent responsibility for your life. That's where meaningful change happens. Share on X

I remember after the class I felt like I could breathe. It was a three-day class. I remember walking through my apartment doing the breaststroke like, “What is this space in front of me?” I don’t even understand it. I had anxiety for a couple of years. I’ve been working with a therapist for a few years, and we got it down from an 11 to a 3, but a 3 still meant that I woke up every day terrified and that my heart was beating out of my chest every day. Nobody knew because I was like, “How’s it going?” I’ve got a great smile. I was like, “This is cool,” but what was happening was something very different on the inside.

I realized in that moment of appreciating all that space that my anxiety was gone. It was the first time in a couple of years that my body was out of fight or flight. It blew me away. I flipped out. I signed up for every single class I could take. I didn’t even know how to describe what I had been through and what it was. I knew I had to do it. I had to do it for myself, my family, and my friends. That’s as far as I got.

A few weeks after this, some of the symptoms started coming back. For anxiety, it’s a little bit, but by then, I was already in class and taking classes. I shifted away. You know when something in your life is an issue, and it’s up to here, and that slowly comes down until you stop noticing that it’s there and you go on with your life. That’s what happened. I can’t tell you the day that left, but I can tell you it did. I doubled my income. My relationships got better.

I believe that this changed the foundation of my life. I’m in a very happy marriage. We’ve been together for many years. We have a wonderful kid. We have a tight close relationship. Financially, everything’s going great. It worked out. There’s always growth to be made and things we need to do. I can’t say I’ve reached Nirvana, and I’m on the hilltop looking down, but I can say that life is amazing, and I have this tool with me all the time, and anytime I need it. I thank God for that.

I love that story. I love how you talk about, “It’s great, but there’s always room for more.” I was at a mastermind, and she said, “For us, there’s the yumminess of more.” You can be so excited, happy, and delighted with where you are, but there is this yumminess of more. What’s that next evolution? What’s that next level of joy or that next level of intimacy in our relationships? I also love how you were talking about yourself and how it started above your head. You bring your head down, and it starts up above your head, the stress levels, and then you bring it down until it disappears from your heart.

In a lot of theta healing, and I had this with many of my clients in the early days, they wouldn’t even remember what they had come to me for. You would do this session, and they would be like, “I feel great.” You have to remind them at the end of the session, “This is what you came for. You said you were at a 7, 8, 10, or 12 of 10.” They’re like, “What? That’s not even an issue.” You then try to talk to them next time, and they don’t even remember. For you, it was a process, and you remember the process. With Theta, sometimes it disappears, and it maybe not even a part of your memory base. If you remember it, it’s like it happened to somebody else.

I had that same experience myself. People would say, “Moneeka, do you remember when?” I’m like, “I don’t remember that pain, trauma, and all those things,” which is interesting. I don’t know if you do this, Karen, but I got into this habit of having people write it down. You don’t want them affirming bad things, but I would like them to write it down in their own handwriting what they were trying to fix, so I get to hand it to them and say, “This is what happened. Tell me what you notice in your life around that.” I don’t want to say magical because that takes it out of the realm of science, but it does feel in many cases.

REW Karen Abrams | Unlock Your Power

Unlock Your Power: A simple meditation allows you to connect to your inner wisdom source and also connect to your subconscious mind. When you make that connection, you’re able to access your bottom beliefs and change on the ones that really are messing with you and your life.


I agree. I remember I had a friend when I was taking all the classes. When we were towards the end of all of our education, she was like, “When I first met you, you didn’t even notice me,” I was, “That’s so weird. I don’t even understand that.” She’s like, “I remember we were eating together, and you were in your own world.”

Isn’t it funny? I understand. Tell us what theta healing is. Why don’t you describe it from your perspective?

It took me years to figure out how to do that. I don’t know if it did for you too.

It’s the thing with brainwaves.

When Vianna would describe it, I was so high in theta. I was like, “What did you say? I don’t understand.” What theta healing is a simple meditation that allows you to connect to your inner wisdom, source, whatever that name is for you, and also connect to your subconscious mind. When you make that connection, you’re able to access your bottom beliefs and change them, the ones that are messing with you and your life.

That is, “I’m nothing. I’m worthless. I’m unlovable. Nothing ever turns out for me.” With your permission, you can energetically shift these beliefs. Since we’re in the subconscious mind, we have access to all of these trapped emotions. There are things we’ve inherited, like trauma, anger, and betrayal. There are things that we went through of the same name, like sadness, grief, and all these things that have been there forever or for too long. When you’re in that theta state, your mind can talk to your body and help you release it. What gets replaced is unconditional love, understanding, and compassion.

What happens is when you take your most damaging beliefs and change them into your most powerful and positive ones, and when you replace these old toxic emotions with your most supportive ones, you start feeling better and lighter. You start making decisions in support of yourself. The dynamics in your relationships change in a loving way in your favor.

We have to practice self-care. We have to create that time where we're at the top of the list, because it's easiest for us to break promises to ourselves. Share on X

The cool thing at the end of all of that, which was cool enough already, is that those barriers to following the great advice that you’ve heard and to take the actions that you’ve needed to do to move your life forward will come down. You start moving forward with more ease and focus, like a new lightness and joy. That’s what I have noticed.

The way that I used to describe it is very technical. I was scientific. There are four different brainwaves, but theta is the deepest brainwave we have access to. It happens naturally in sleep, which is why we talk so much about it, where you get messages from the universe and your subconscious when you’re sleeping. I believe it’s the place we are in, REM. Is that true? Do I remember correctly?

It’s right when we’re accessing our dream state. It’s at that point when we’re starting to space out, and we don’t know where we are. We’re on the fence between two worlds.

That’s the dream state, so you’re already asleep. You’re already gone way past alpha which is the normal meditation state that we do. You’re about to go into REM. You’re already deeply asleep and about to go into this dream state. You’re wide open for the messages, but you’re not getting the messages, or your subconscious is getting the messages, or they’re working through those messages that you’ve delivered to it.

It’s this interesting place. I’ve done some interesting things. What happens when you’re in this place is your vibration rises, and you’re sending your vibration out into the world. Readers, I hope this isn’t too woo-woo for you, but this is how it works. You know that I’m all about bliss. You know that your vibration impacts what happens to you, what you’re delivering out into the world energetically, and how you receive and perceive things. That’s why we talk so much about bliss.

You can use theta to create that energetic field. It’s like a radio, where you’re receiving and delivering. You can deliver out into the world and have this impact. I would have these things that would happen. I would have a tenant in one of my houses that was having problems. I remember once I got a call from a tenant that said, “Moneeka, I have lost my job. I’m not going to be able to pay for three months.” I said, “That’s fine.” He’s been with me for a couple of years. “I’m not going to put pressure on you, but let’s see what we can do about this. I am very happy to continue to have you be my tenant.” He was not able to make it one month, but he made up for that.

What I had done is I did my own theta process on his healing around money. I did it remotely as a surrogate for him because he wasn’t open to it. He got a new job. The next time I saw him, he was uplifted. We can’t heal other people. I’m not trying to say that, but I was healing that business process or that business exchange of money.

REW Karen Abrams | Unlock Your Power

Unlock Your Power: When you take your most damaging beliefs and you change them into your most powerful and positive ones, and replace these old toxic emotions with your most supportive ones, you’ll start feeling better and lighter and you start making decisions in support of yourself.


I’ve done this many times when I want to find the perfect tenant. I ended up with a house empty on December 1st. That’s the worst time to find a new tenant. I did a theta process and had a tenant within two days. It’s so interesting that we can use this not just in our relationships, our money, and our beliefs, but it’s the energy we send out into the world and the expectation that we magnetize back to us. It is a phenomenal tool on so many levels. Does that resonate with what you’ve experienced, too?

Absolutely. I remember I had a business mentor who said, ‘”Business is one of the most powerful vehicles for self-improvement because whatever we do or don’t do, it comes back to us.” The other description of theta is it’s like focused prayer. We’re connecting to that energy that makes everything happen and putting something positive into the mix. When we were talking about a cycle, what you feel inside you emanates out, and then the universe reflects that back. When you go into worry, which is this focus on a bad outcome. “What if this happens?” If you went into that space, it’s like, “He’ll never be able to pay. This guy that I love, I have to kick out.”

We all have a reaction. That’s okay. We got to come back from that afterward and go, “What is this triggering?” Get to the deepest part of that. Maybe there was an original wound, something going on, or something about being disappointing because you’re a people pleaser. You get to the bottom of that, and it opens up that space also for somebody else to move freely.

Everybody’s got a role in the family like, “Here’s the black sheep. This is the one who never makes it and can’t rub two nickels together.” Every time you look or think of them, you have this low vibrational signal you send out, like, “It’s okay to stay this way. This is how I expect you to be.” When you open that up and get yourself out of the mix, it frees them up to do what they need to do.

They do their own path. The thing is, we don’t want to be infringing on someone else’s path. Everybody’s here for their own learning, growing, or whatever it is that they’re supposed to be doing. As long as we deliver angst, worry, or expectation, we’re delivering our interference into their path. I understand what you’re saying about that. The result that you get is not always what you expect.

Have Faith

The universe works in interesting ways. It’s not always exactly what you expect. The next step to that is having faith that it’s happening as it’s supposed to. It’s not necessarily how I expected, but as it’s supposed to be. That’s helped me to go through that theta process, too, when it didn’t happen instantaneously, but to know that, “This was the first step. Now, here’s the next step.” It’s like that.

Let’s say he didn’t get a job immediately, but something else happened so that you could go, “I found a grant for him.” You don’t know how it’s going to show up. Even at first, it looks like contrast and something that appears negative. It’s like, “Maybe the solution to that thing is the thing that’s going to get all of this done.”

Having “me” time is very important. You need to have something that keeps you grounded and center that takes you away from your day-to-day business. Share on X

Everyone you bring here, I’ll take a good educated guess that they’ve had some major thing happen to them that caused them to do the amazing work they were doing. In the beginning, it was the worst thing ever or somewhere around there, but they made it the best thing ever. Was it really that? We don’t know what we’re looking at. When we judge it in one way, we’re holding it in a space too tight of a box, and we got to open that up.

We can talk about this forever. Let’s talk about the driver’s seat. You talk a lot about you can be in the driver’s seat of your life always. What do you mean by that?

We’re always in the driver’s seat, even if we feel like we’re in the passenger seat, because it’s your life. You’re living the consequences of your life all the time, whether you’ve got a bossy partner who makes all the decisions for you or you make them yourself. This is about you. I want to give you an example. There’s an amazing statistic out there that you probably know that women lose up to $1.5 million in lifetime earnings because they’re afraid to ask for a raise. When they ask for a raise, they typically ask for 30% less than men.

We live with those results. We live with that vacuum. If we don’t fill it, we have this income vacuum that won’t take care of us when we’re older, yet if we decide and know that we’re in the driver’s seat, we can change that around and fill that space with something that’s going to support us when we need it. When I think of real estate, is there any business that has more of that in it? The decisions you make, don’t make, and the actions you take and don’t take turn up in a property, no property, worst property, or in the best. As you said, the best tenant is a nightmare. All of those things are always going on. We have to know that in order for us to come from a different and more powerful place to create what we want to create.

That was so powerful. I want the readers to sink into that. You are in the driver’s seat. You may feel like you’re in the passenger seat. I’m going to repeat this because you said it so well. You may have a bossy partner that you think is in the driver’s seat, but you are driving the car, and that is your life. You picked that partner. In your car, that person is the backseat driver. They’re in the passenger seat in your life. Not your life together, whatever that looks like, but your life.

I released a panel where I talked about conscious leadership and how we’re all leaders. It’s that same thing. We’re all leaders in this thing that we’re calling our life. We’re making our own decisions, even if that decision is to turn over all of our power to somebody else. That’s a decision we make, and that is you being the leader in your own life. That is you being the driver in your own car.

“I’ve decided that I don’t want that responsibility. I’m going to turn it over to somebody else.” Maybe we haven’t made that consciously. That’s maybe how we’ve been trained to live in the world, but you are still making that choice. We always have a choice. We’re always a driver in our own world. As I said in that panel, we’re always the leader of our own life, which can show up in many different ways. Talk to me about being in the driver’s seat in a more meaningful way, rather than, “You just are.”

REW Karen Abrams | Unlock Your Power

Unlock Your Power: When you lose faith in yourself, it’s going to reflect back out in the outer world and show you in a dissatisfying deal and unsatisfying client, whatever that is.


Make Yourself A Priority

Here’s the way you can do this in meaningful and empowering ways. The first thing you need to do is take 100% responsibility for your life. That’s where meaningful change happens. If we don’t do that and you’re always like, “No, it’s not,” you can’t be the victim here. You’re the one who’s painting the picture, so that’s first. The second thing you have to do is you have to create me time. There has to be a place in your life where you’re at the top of the list. “I am a wife and a mother of a teenager. I am a daughter of an elderly parent with health issues.” I know when I’m 4th or 5th on the list. That has to happen sometimes, but we have to create that time where we’re at the top of the list because it’s easiest for us to break promises to ourselves.

I don’t want to break a promise to my kid because she looks at me and goes, “You promised.” I don’t want to do that to my partner. I don’t want to do that to other people and see that look, but I can’t see the look on my face, but it happens. What happens is if I become disappointed in myself and break promises, I lose faith in myself and my ability to carry out my promises, which breeds dissatisfaction. This brings us back to what we were talking about before, which is if that’s what’s going on inside, it’s going to reflect back out in the outer world and show you a dissatisfying deal and unsatisfying client, whatever that is. We want to have that me time. That’s very important.

You need to have something that keeps you grounded and centered that takes you away from your day-to-day business, “I’m doing emails. I’m doing calls. I’m with clients.” You have to have something that’s completely away from that. Meditation is very important to me. That helps you stay grounded and centered in the face of chaos if that happens. Since we had COVID, we know that can happen. When things are great, and the skies are blue, it helps you soar. You can be happy for no reason. What’s better than that?

You talked about 100% responsibility. I want to go back to that. I talk a lot about me time on this show. As a women’s show and as women, we are the masters of taking care of everybody else and letting ourselves down. Building that faith in our own selves and keeping our promises to ourselves is as important. The thing is to make promises that you can keep. You’re going to make a promise to your child that you’re going to keep. You’re going to make a promise to your partner that you know you can keep.

When you make promises to yourself, make sure you’re making promises you know you can keep. In other words, don’t say, “I’ve got no me-time for myself in three years. Now, every day, I’m going to have two hours for a bubble bath.” You’re never going to be able to live up to that. It’s like, “I can do a five-minute meditation now because I haven’t done anything for myself for so long. I’m trying to build those muscles,” but you need to make commitments to yourself that you can keep and then keep them because you need to learn how to trust yourself.

This is important in business, too, because when you’re out there and don’t trust yourself, how are you going to make your own decisions? You’re going to doubt everything that you do. You’re going to doubt your promises to others, your ability to make decisions, and your ability to deal with the consequences of those decisions. That’s the biggest fear of all. It’s, “I’m going to get this property. What if it turns out to be this nightmare, and I can’t deal with it?” If you trust yourself, you can deal with it. You want to build that trust. This piece of 100% responsibility is hard. Would you say that you found that this is the hardest piece?

Yes. People tend to identify with being a victim.

Meditation is very important and that helps you stay grounded and centered in the face of chaos if that happens. Share on X

Blame is the ultimate self-victimization. “The economy is bad. We’re in inflation. I can’t buy a house. Look at interest rates have gone up. I hate the president. This country is going to hell,” whatever it is, I don’t believe those things. I’m saying that this is what I hear. There’s so much out there that can victimize us that we have no control over.

We can vote. Some of us get politically involved, but we feel victimized by that. That’s the macro level, but then in our own lives, it’s like, “My husband’s bossy. My children are needy. My dog always is at the hospital.” There are all these problems, “I don’t have control.” That is self-victimization. You don’t necessarily have control, but what you do have control over is how you choose to respond. That choice to respond is what you have to take 100% responsibility for.

When you make a choice, and then there’s an outcome, you can be victimized by, “I made that choice. It didn’t work out.” Make the decision or the choice that you see this outcome, “That wasn’t awesome. What other choice can I make that will bring a better outcome?” We feel victimized by what’s going on out there. We can if we choose to, or we can choose to respond in ways that support our own bliss and joy in our own lives.

I agree with that. One of the things that I talk about in a session, and I’m sure you know this too, is the difference between responsibility and blame. Blame is a judgment, and it puts you in a corner. You have to get out of the blame. “I can’t get out of that corner because I’m bad. I did a dumb thing. How could I be so blockheaded? I keep pelting myself in that corner.”

You have to get out and heal that. All responsibility is, “Yes, I’m here. I did this. Every decision I’ve made got me here. If I’m that powerful, I can go anywhere. I just ended up here, but I can go somewhere else.” It’s a little directional change. I always talk about it like if you had a cannon pointed at one village and put it 3 degrees West, it would eventually hit a whole other place. That’s what we do. We make these minor changes that down the road will become huge, and we’ll end up in a whole different wonderful place because of it.

They’re little course corrections.

We do them. It’s life.

REW Karen Abrams | Unlock Your Power

Unlock Your Power: If you don’t have a really great self-worth of your self-sabotaging, that’s what’s going to show up in properties. You’re not going to get the properties you want, but if you do that inner work to clear yourself up and be in that blissful, joyful space, then you’re going to create that on the outside world.


It’s the way that it is. I took a class on flying a helicopter. It was so hard. Part of it is because those propellers don’t have wings, so you’re in constant course correction. You can’t even hold it straight because it will go the wrong way. In our lives, that’s a fairly dramatic view, but it is true. I say this in my book, Choose Bliss. We’re constantly course-correcting. From the moment we wake up in the morning, we decide what time we’re getting up, whether we’re going to push the snooze button, what we’re going to do with that time when we get out of bed, which side we’re going to get out of the bed, “Are we going to push these sheets back? Am I going to pet the dog? Am I going to run to the restroom?”

In five minutes of the alarm going off, it’s all these choices that we’ve made. Most of them are not conscious choices, but I’m saying that we are constantly on course correct. Each one of those choices could have been different. I could have chosen not to snooze the alarm. I could have chosen I wanted to drink some water first instead of running to the restroom. There are a lot of choices that I could make, even in the first minutes of our day, that will course correct and set me up for success.

It’s a thing that we, as humans, are constantly doing. It’s something we do anyways. Why not see it as your responsibility and keep that course correct in a way that’s going to support you as best as you can? You see the consequences and the results. If they’re not what you like, you course-correct some more. You do something a little bit differently. Tell me some examples of some of your clients that have stepped into this power of full responsibility, being in the driver’s seat, and those things.

I’ll talk first with a client I have worked with a lot. She has a tutoring business. I worked with her for a long time. She was towards the beginning of her business. Her gift was to teach young children. She could speak their language and loved them, but she didn’t have a formal education. It created this insecurity because she was going into the educational business. At that space, the parents are college educated or higher, and all of this stuff, and she’s coming into these environments. She also had very serious health issues that affected her memory, concentration, focus, and energy, which could happen at any moment. She had to be taking care of herself constantly.

As we said, business is a motivation for self-improvement. “What’s happening this week? What’s going on with you?” It was the insecurity that was playing. We would work on what are the root causes of all of that right at this moment. She could learn from it, let it go, and be like, “Cool.” She could work with her clients better. If she had a health issue, it’s the same thing, “What does it remind you of? What’s the root issue?” We would do the same thing, find the root issues, heal them, and move on. She went from an upper 5-figure business to a 6-figure business to a 7-figure business. She is looking to create this as an 8-figure business, and I have no doubt that she will get there. You can see the evolution. It was cool.

We’ve got another one who is in a relationship. This couple was in that tough spot. We all have those years where they’re hard or something. They kept disappointing, angering, and triggering each other to the point where they fought all the time. They had a kid, so the kid is in the middle of this and is not having a great time here.

I saw them separately. It was like, “What is your partner triggering in you? What’s the wound your partner’s triggering you? Is it by saying, ‘Pass the salt,’ or, ‘You didn’t get that done?'” We found all of those root causes and healed them, which gave them each more compassion for themselves. They were no longer triggered by what the other person was saying because they were coming from a different place, and they got it. It saved their marriage. They turned into this tight little happy family unit. They’re thriving even now. It’s wonderful.

Your net worth only goes as high as your self-worth. Share on X

I have one in real estate one that I wanted to share with you too. I was working with a guy in commercial real estate who had some issues with his dad. We all have an issue with a parent somewhere. We got to the root of that thing. We’re able to heal it. He was able to forgive and have this beautiful outcome with him. Right after that, he had this $10,000 deal fall in his lap that came out of nowhere in real estate. He was like, “Okay.” It opened up a space that he didn’t know was filled with this anger, resentment, and withholding of love. Those are some of the amazing things that have happened when you can open up and receive this stuff.

I love the relationship thing that can help with partners, business partners, negotiation, and all of that stuff. It’s amazing. First of all, readers, have you loved this? I love theta, and I love Karen. I hope you’ve loved it too. In EXTRA, we’re going to be doing a sample session, and the focus is going to be being money worthy. I’m looking forward to that. That will be fun. How can people get in touch with you?

It’s pretty easy. You can go to my website, which is ThinkTheta.com. Contact me from there. I have my phone number and my email there, which is [email protected], so it’s easy for you to reach me.

She also has a free gift which is at BlissfulInvestor.com/Theta. Can you tell us a little bit about what the gift is?

This is a theta meditation that I call Enough Already. This is about letting you know what it feels like to have all of your needs met. When you come to the table with all of your needs met, you have the discernment to know what’s in front of you. “Is this a good deal? Is this a bad deal?” You’re not coming from that vacuum of fear, worry, or insecurity. You’re coming from this place of being completely sated and going, “That sounds great. That’s good. I’m going to pass on that.”

The more you fill yourself up with everything you need and the feeling of it, the more you will create it in the outside world. It’s wonderful. I also suggest very wholeheartedly that you do this right before you go to bed because whatever you end your evening with, it’s going to marinate in your subconscious mind for another eight hours. You might as well get the most bang for your free buck here.

I love that. You can go to BlissfulInvestor.com/Theta. You can take a look at that, but thank you so much for that gift.

REW Karen Abrams | Unlock Your Power

Unlock Your Power: Life happens for you, not to you. That’s going to help you react in ways that are really constructive and help you move into that space of creating the outcomes that you really desire.


You are so welcome.

Are you ready for our three rapid-fire questions?

I am.

Give us one super tip on getting started investing in real estate.

Regain Self-Worth

You got to remember this. Your net worth only goes as high as your self-worth. As we’ve been talking about before, if you don’t have great self-worth and if you’re self-sabotaging, that’s what’s going to show up. You’re not going to get the properties you want, but if you do that inner work to clear yourself up and be in that blissful and joyful space, then you’re going to create that in the outside world. It’s going to come to you.

What is one strategy for being successful as a real estate investor?

That is about getting comfortable with change. As we learned from COVID, we need to be able to pivot. We might not have to pivot all the way around, but enough to make that happen. Change is always with us. We saw a global version of it. We’ll never know if that could happen again, but knowing that you’re comfortable with it is going to build your resilience. If it builds your resilience, it’s also going to be this place that’s fodder for more creativity. Creativity is the mother of invention. It’s great.

It also gives you confidence that you can handle anything like what we were talking about. What is one daily practice that you do that contributes to your personal success?

I’m going to give you two because I already gave you the one that’s the biggie, which is meditation. Meditation saves me. When COVID hit and everything shut down, it’s the thing that saved me from staying calm and go, “What needs to get done?” This is the new little thing I wanted to give you. We also need little energetic practices. I always say metaphorically, “Stub our toe,” and we go, “Ouch,” and it starts to ruin our day. We need to be able to shift back into that positive energy.

Get comfortable with change. We need to be able to pivot. Share on X

Here’s one easy thing that you can do anytime that happens to you. Let’s say something bad happens right at the moment, and you don’t get this client, or a deal falls through. At that moment, close your eyes and say, “Thank you,” and then ask the question, “How does it get any better than this?” What happens is when you go into the thank you, you’re going into gratitude. That’s the receiving mode. When you are grateful, you can’t be mad because you’re grateful. Even when it happens, it’s getting you out of anger or those things. You just keep saying it.

That, “How does it get any better than this,” is training your brain at that moment. Instead of saying, “What could be worse?” which is a lot of places we go to and get pessimistic quickly, you’re focusing on what’s going to be the better thing that happens next. That’s going to bring about a better outcome and bring about your actions, which will manifest a better outcome. It’s an easy thing you can have in your pocket at any time. It’s great. I use it all the time.

That’s so interesting. I love that. I’m going to try that. This has been so amazing. Karen, do you have parting words for my readers?

One of the most important things to remember is an old saying, but it’s a good one, “Life happens for you, not to you.” That’s going to help you react in ways that are constructive and help you move into that space of creating the outcomes that you desire. As I was saying, we don’t know if this event changed our whole life and, on that day, which might’ve been the worst day of our life, turned into the best thing that ever happened to us. When you remember that in the moment of something going on, it could change the way you react to it. What you were saying, and as a mentor of mine said, “How you react will determine your existence.”

There are so many tweetable quotes in this show. Thank you so much, Karen. That was so valuable. Readers, stay tuned. We’ve got more in EXTRA. We’re going to be doing a sample theta on being money worthy, which I love. If you are subscribed to EXTRA, stay tuned. If you are not, go to RealEstateInvestingForWomenEXTRA.com, and you can get this there for free for the first few days. After that, you can subscribe if you feel like it’s valuable content.

For those of you that are leaving us, thank you so much for joining Karen and me for this portion of the show. You know how much I appreciate you. I look forward to seeing you next time and until then, remember goals without action are just dreams. Get out there, take action, and create the life your heart deeply desires. I’ll see you next episode.


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About Karen Abrams

REW Karen Abrams | Unlock Your PowerKaren Abrams is a UCLA educated, entrepreneur, Master Theta Healer, relationship expert, and gifted intuitive. She is also an award-winning international bestselling author. She works with professional women to transform their subconscious beliefs and self-sabotaging behaviors to create new habits, mindsets and actions that bring about personal and financial fulfillment. Graduated in psychology.

Karen has honed the skills critical to Theta Healing, and as a student of meditation, her insight and intuition allow her to identify and pinpoint root causes of long-standing issues to create new understandings, forgiveness and strong inner resources. She has worked with thousands of clients worldwide who are at a crossroads in their lives- helping them heal the underlying causes of their issues and get clarity and understanding on how to move forward from there. Karen is dedicated to helping women break free from living in survival mode so they can bring about fulfilled, healthy and balanced lives.


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REI Expert Panel Discussion: What You Need To Know About Real Estate Investing

REW Amazing | Real Estate Investing


Have you always wanted to get into real estate investing but didn’t know where to start? Then this episode is for you. Today, Laura Powers hosts a real estate investing panel with some amazing experts, Henry Washington, Mike Denman, Patricia Berman, and Moneeka Sawyer. Having their fair share of success in real estate investing, the panelists break down barriers to entry in real estate investing. They make it simple and inspire people to know that no matter where you are, it is possible to get started with real estate investing. Enjoy!

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REI Expert Panel Discussion: What You Need To Know About Real Estate Investing

Real Estate Investing for Women

I was on a real estate panel with some cool people and the conversation was fantastic. I wanted to share that with you. That’s what this episode is. I hope you enjoy it.

I’m so excited. I’m hosting this Intro to Real Estate Investing Panel with some amazing experts. I’m so excited to have all of our participants and experts here. A little bit about myself. My name is Laura. I’m a psychic medium. I do a lot of different things. I describe myself as a creative entrepreneur. As I started to make more money, I felt the need to learn more about money, how to invest property and how to be smart with money because I didn’t have that growing up in my family. It’s been something that I had to undertake on my own independently. If you don’t know how to handle your money and you get more, you will not accumulate more money, which is the desired goal for up for most people.

Even though I would not describe myself as a real estate investment expert, I’m a novice but I do know all these amazing people that are better at it than I am and that is farther along in their journey. In talking with all of these individuals, I realized they had so much amazing knowledge to share. In particular, focusing on new investors. There are lots of great tips and tools.

It can be somewhat intimidating to start investing in real estate when you’re a beginner, so part of my goal for this panel is to try to break it down, make it simple and inspire people to know that no matter where you are, it is possible to get started in real estate investing. That’s a little bit about me and why I wanted to host this panel. We’re going to introduce the experts one by one and then we’ll dive into some questions and answers.

First, I want to introduce Henry Washington. He’s an author, entrepreneur and real estate investor with more than 70 rental units and dozens of house flips under his belt. He built his rental portfolio in three and a half years. That’s so amazing. I was talking with Henry in my podcast and I said, “This is the length of a Bachelor’s degree if you think of the amount of time in your future for a degree.” That’s what he has done and has these incredible shifts. Henry is the newest co-host of The BiggerPockets Podcast and cast member of the BiggerPockets show On the Market. Thanks so much for being a guest, Henry.

I’m so happy to be here.

Is there anything you’d like to say before we introduce the other guests?

I’m happy to be here. This is super cool what you’re doing. I’m very passionate about real estate investing as a vehicle to build wealth. I love how you’ve mentioned that if you don’t learn how to handle your money, your money will handle you. Everybody wealthy owns the property. Even if you don’t use real estate to build your wealth, most people then put their wealth into real estate to grow it. I love that you’re trying to educate people on how to not only make money but how to continue to have that money grow. Kudos to you.

REW Amazing | Real Estate Investing

Real Estate Investing: Real estate investing is a vehicle to build wealth.


Thank you. That’s a huge goal of mine and with inflation being 9%, it’s more important now than ever. We met at this real estate investing track. I was struck by Henry’s story and how he didn’t have a lot of money saved up. I wanted to give people that background and that’s how we connected. It was inspiring to me because I want everyone to know that you can get involved in real estate even if you perceive that you don’t have capital. There’s always a way. I’m so pleased to have you.

Let’s go to Mike Denman. He is an award-winning filmmaker based out of Denver. He’s worked in marketing advertising for video games since 2011 and real estate since 2015. He’s been at the forefront of technological advancement and connecting people to content through internet apps like Instagram, Facebook, Pinterest, YouTube and many others.

He’s adapting his real estate advertising tactics to encourage higher amounts of traffic to short-term rental listings as possible due to his years of iterating the process. He’s been a real estate investor for years. We met through the film industry. I have learned that there are a lot of people that are in film and TV that use real estate investing to build a platform, which is amazing. Mike, go ahead.

Real estate is powerful. When we met, your podcast was first starting and you were seeing where all the trajectory went. You realized real estate was a thing that you wanted to get into. I, separately with Patricia, ended up going through the real estate investing side because she was like, “I want to get more into real estate.” It’s a natural progression but from two different angles.

Mike, I would love to hear if there’s anything else you’d like to share.

A fun thing about how we met is we met at the Women in Film & Media Colorado division. It was a female-led organization that still allowed male members. I was part of their marketing committee for a year or something like that. That’s when I met you and ultimately, all the trajectories that we’ve gone. It’s interesting because of your trajectory when we met, your podcasts blew up and all of these little pieces of the puzzle.

Having the real estate aspect be something that you found is like, “I’m going to put money into money-making things.” This is a surefire approach because everyone knows that you can increase your wealth with real estate. It makes sense that a lot of filmmakers and other people are like, “I have all these things but I don’t have a traditional 401(k).” Real estate becomes a cool add-on to it. It’s all super fun stuff.

I don’t think everyone knows. If you were in creative work, that’s often not as reliable as a regular paycheck because you tend to do a lot of freelancing or any other kind of freelancing work where you don’t have a regular paycheck, then something like this that can build wealth and have income that’s not tied to a paycheck is valuable as well. One of the stats I heard is that the average millionaire has eight or more sources of income. It’s also great for diversifying, even if real estate isn’t your main thing, what a powerful thing to be able to have at least one of your pockets of income.

Our next guest is Patricia Berman. She’s been a real estate investor since 2014. Patricia’s real estate journey began in 2014 with purchasing a primary residence and selling it two years later with a nice appreciation, repeating that process while holding the previous primary residences and running them out as long-term rentals. After a long stint investing solely in the Colorado market, she expanded to Iowa, Texas and California.

In 2022, Patricia took her love for hosting and service and dove into short-term rentals. She is successfully doling out hospitality by managing her two vacation properties with her partner, Mike Denman. Patricia is writing a book on leverage and she hopes to help other people find the courage they need to jump into real estate on their terms. Thanks for joining us, Patricia.

There are many ways to dip your toes into real estate, be successful, and get that stream of income happening for you, no matter what you do, no matter what your strengths are. Share on X

Thank you so much for having me. I’m so excited to be here and talk about real estate. I’ve spent a lot of time listening to BiggerPockets and realizing that there’s a style of real estate for everybody. There are so many ways that you can dip your toes into real estate, be successful and get that stream of income happening for you no matter what you do and what your strengths are.

I found what I love. We are invested in some long-term rentals but short-term rentals have souped up our portfolio. It’s not for everybody but I love it. The important message is to find what you love in real estate and do it on your terms. That’s what we’re doing. I want people out there to know that you can do this and it’s important to build wealth.

Another reason I wanted to host this panel specifically is that there are so many different ways to approach real estate. The more I got into it, the more I realized that you could flip, hold for long-term and do long-term rentals. You can do short-term rentals.

Also, house hack.

There are so many different ways like multifamily. It opens that door for people to see the different ways. In your case, you’re doing many of these different models. You’re not doing just one but based on your personality, one or more approaches might work for you. If you think it’s about flipping or short-term rentals to open your idea about the different ways that you can approach this, then find a real estate investing pattern and a method that works for you.

It doesn’t have to be one thing or another.

I’m going to introduce Moneeka Sawyer. She is the host of a talk-related podcast, Real Estate Investing For Women. Her expertise and joyous laugh have been featured all over the world in over 50 podcasts, on stages, on radio and TV stations, including ABC, CBS, Fox and The CW. Her multimillion-dollar real estate empire is only one example of her ability to strategize, organize and implement big business plans.

She is the bestselling author of the book, Choose Bliss: The Power and Practice of Joy and Contentment, which has built a multimillion-dollar business through real estate. Moneeka teaches others how to create a blissful and abundant lifestyle. She has traveled to over 55 countries and loves to teach others. I’d love to start with a question to the panelists. If you were starting from square one, what do you recommend? You’re like, “I’ve never invested in real estate. Where do I start? What do I do? What do I learn?”

It depends on age but house hacking is one of the best ways to start a real estate portfolio, especially in this market when you’re looking at something where interest rates are rising and there’s a little bit of uncertainty in the market. Use what you have. When you purchase as a primary residence, you’re going to have access to lower interest rates and reduce your overhead by either renting out extra rooms in your house. If you don’t want to share a space with other people, you can get up to a four-unit property and rent out the other units.

REW Amazing | Real Estate Investing

Real Estate Investing: House hacking is one of the best ways to start a real estate portfolio.


I am a big fan of house hacking. We even did it as a family where we had one extra room and rented it out to women who were single moms and stuff like that. We’ve vetted super well and it worked out well for us. We made a lot of lifelong friends that way. That’s one of the best ways to get started. There are many but that’s my go-to.

There are so many ways to go about it. One of the things that’s interesting to me is even when it’s a tough market for buying and selling as a whole, it’s still a good rental market. Keep that in mind that even if it’s harder to buy something, you might be able even more easily to rent it because people that would be buying aren’t buying. Either Mike or Henry, I would love to hear your responses too.

My response is the same as Patricia’s because that’s the trajectory we are going on. What do you think, Henry?

Getting started is super intimidating to people and it’s, even more, intimidating given the economic environment. People are concerned, “Am I buying at the top of the market? Am I paying more for the money for higher interest rates? Is there going to be a crash?” This war overseas is pushing prices of commodities up. People are like, “Is this the right time?” The answer is it’s always the right time. It’s a matter of what and how you buy.

When I’m talking to people about getting started with real estate investing, the majority of it is about your mindset around real estate investing. We’ve all mentioned it multiple times already in the short time we’ve been on the show. There are so many different ways to invest. A lot of those ways to invest are going to be more beneficial for one person versus another based on their financial situation.

To be able to tell you this is the best method for you is not easy to do without knowing what your financial situation is or what your super strengths are. What people should focus on is first making a decision, deciding you’re going to buy a property, even though you don’t know how or you don’t have the down payment. Maybe you think you don’t have the credit or you can’t find the property to buy. All these factors are going to come into play that we will tell ourselves is a reason we can’t do something.

Take all that off the table and say, “I am going to buy a property in the next 3, 6 or 12 months,” whatever that is for you. You have to make that decision in your mind and heart. Once you are solid on that decision, you’ll figure out a way. The show will reveal itself to you. Here are Laura, Patricia and Mike. You’ll know something that somebody says about a path that maybe makes sense for you. Patricia talked about house hacking. Maybe somebody who’s made the decision to start investing in real estate didn’t know about house hacking but now they know.

They’re going to go do some research and maybe that’s how they get in the game. When you’re starting, it’s more about deciding. “No matter what, I’m going to figure out how to do this and do it.” I promise, once you’ve truly made that decision and you keep immersing yourself in real estate investing culture, information and knowledge and surrounding yourself with people who are successful real estate investors, you will figure out a way to do it.

There’s a way to do it with no money, with some money, with other people’s money and when you buy deals on the market or off the market like house hacking. There are short-term and long-term rentals. One of these strategies will make sense for you. You only have to make a decision that you’re going to continue to educate and surround yourself with people who are doing it. Until that path reveals itself, you got to go down that path. That’s what I tell people who are getting started.

When you keep immersing yourself in real estate, investing culture, information, knowledge, and surrounding yourself with people who are successful real estate investors, you will figure out a way to do it. Share on X

Forgive me. I’m having a lot of problems too. The universe is saying something and I’m not sure what that is. I heard what Henry was saying and one of the things that I say on my show is goals without action are just dreams. Get out there, take action and create the life of your dreams. What everybody here is stating is first, Henry says you have to make a decision. Everything in our lives starts with a decision and a choice to follow that decision. Once you make that decision, action has to follow because otherwise, it’s only words in your head.

I loved what Henry was saying. I’m so sorry that I missed what Mike and Patricia said. It’s important that we make a goal and make a choice to take action towards that goal. That’s how we create the wealth and the blissful life that we want. I do want to go back and make a couple of comments about what Laura said. She said that most rich people have eight sources of income. Don’t misunderstand that by thinking that it was eight sources of income that you work. It’s not.

Most of those sources of income are passive and the things that rich people work at are the things that they’re passionate about. They’ll have one thing maybe that they are passionate about and they pour their heart into but these passive sources of income are what create the wealth. Henry also said that most wealthy people own real estate. That’s true. They may not have made their money there but that’s where they put their money later, which is what Laura is doing.

She’s modeling that for us, which is beautiful. You have to understand that 8 sources of income do not mean you need 8 jobs. Passive income is the key and real estate is the most stable way to get that passive income. The other thing that I want to say is there are 1 million ways to make $1 million in real estate. Choose one. As Patricia says, there are so many.

The action doesn’t need to look like you went out now and purchased a property. Listen to podcasts like your podcast, the BiggerPockets Podcast and to all of these successful people who have done it in different ways. When you hear one that makes you excited like, “That sounds great.” That’s what I did. Even after I had become a real estate investor, I listened to one with Zeona McIntyre and Avery Carl. I was like, “I’m going to get into short-term rentals.” You have to listen to your gut and heart but start consuming that information because that’s the only way.

That’s the only way that you’re ever going to learn what the opportunities are out there.

Maybe for some other people, it’s not listening to the podcast. Maybe it’s going to Meetups because those are another way.

Networking is a big deal. Thank you so much for mentioning that.

Our community of investors is so huge, welcoming and helpful that it’s like, “Get in where you fit in.”

REW Amazing | Real Estate Investing

Real Estate Investing: Goals without action are just dreams.


You have to understand that because someone else is successful does not mean that you have to do it their way. I love what Henry was talking about. He built all of this passive income in three and a half years. I retired myself in fifteen years because that’s the goal that I had and the choices that I made from my lifestyle. I traveled to 60 countries during that time. I have all these other things that I love to do.

Although I wanted passive income to retire, it didn’t need to happen in three and a half years. I had the time. As you’re looking at what is going to fit for you, understand that Moneeka or Patricia and Mike, Henry’s way or whatever Laura’s way turns out to be, I’m excited to hear, whatever our ways are, it’s opportunities for you to learn but it’s not necessarily going to reach your goals in your way. The way to stay blissful is to make sure that you understand yourself and create a strategy that supports your joy, as well as your wealth. You can have both. I hope that was what you were looking for, Laura.

The next question that I have is, what is your first real estate investing story? What got you into real estate? How did you get started? Let’s start with you, Henry, because one of the reasons to host this panel was to hear your story at Podfest.

I got started a few years ago out of desperation and panic. I had a panic attack because I was freaking out that my wife was going to figure out that I sucked at money and dollars and wasn’t going to be able to afford to provide her with the life that she deserved. I came to that conclusion because we got married fairly quickly. I met my wife and then we got married 365 days later. That was a quick physical transition but as far as mentally and financially, those things didn’t move as quickly as we did. It’s when we decided that we wanted to get married.

I had a wake-up call when we tried to buy a house together. We did all the things. I felt that I did all the things that society tells you to do. I got good grades. I went to school. I got a good degree and a job. I was doing software development and data analytics for Walmart. I was making a great income. We got married and went to buy a house. I’m like, “This is great. I make twice as much as she does. We’ll be able to afford this great house.”

The bank pretty much called me one day and said, “If you want your wife to be able to buy a house, you can’t be on the loan.” My credit was so bad. I made money but I didn’t have any money. There was $1,000 in my savings account. To a bank, I wasn’t bringing anything to the table other than the fact that I had a W-2. That was a big blow to my ego and to me as a person who wanted to provide for my new wife. I got punched in the gut as far as my ability to be able to do that. I had another wake-up call when we were having a conversation one night.

My wife bought that house and allowed me to live with her. Once we moved in, we did the other thing that married couples do, which is talk about your future, kids, dream houses, vacations and things. That’s supposed to be a fun conversation and it wasn’t. For me, I was terrified because I was like, “It’s a dream house but we barely got in this house. I don’t know how to dream house is going to go.” I knew I couldn’t afford it.

It was a starter home. It was a nice home but it was small. After that conversation, we went to bed and I woke up at 3:00 in the morning sweating and panicking because I knew she deserved things that I had no idea how to afford. I had $1,000 in my savings account. I had bad credit, so I did what anybody would do. I started googling, “How can I make some extra money?” That brought me to discovering terms like passive income.

I was like, “How can I make extra money without doing anything?” I started googling how to make passive income and that led me to articles on BiggerPockets and YouTube videos around people who invest in real estate. That was the first time I heard that real estate investing was something that normal people did. Up until that point, I assumed that super-rich people in big companies and things owned real estate and that’s the way it worked. It was an eye-opening moment for me to see that normal people with jobs, kids and families are owning property and they do it all the time across the country. It was mind-blowing to me.

Everything in our lives starts with a decision and a choice to follow that decision. Once you make that decision, action has to follow because otherwise, it's just words in your head. Share on X

I ended up watching this TED Talk from this kid who was 27 years old and had 27 properties. The whole goal of the talk was he was financially free and he used rental properties to get there. I was like, “If this kid figured out how to buy twenty houses and be financially free, I could do it.” I went like, “I’ll do that.” With my bad credit and $1,000 in my savings account and being denied the loan for the house that I was living in at the time, I decided at 3:00 in the morning that I was going to buy real estate. That’s what I did. I woke up my wife and said, “We’re going to be real estate investors.” She was like, “Let’s do it.”

I didn’t know how to do it but I had made a decision. When you decide something, the suffix of the word decide is cide, like suicide. It means to kill off. There’s no other option but to do it when you make a decision. Once I did that, I was like, “I’ll go find people who do it and hang around them a lot until I figured out how to do it.” That’s when I discovered REIA meetings and real estate Meetups. If there was a meeting in my area, I got in the room every single week or month consistently. I wanted to learn and surround myself with people who were doing it so I could learn how to do it.

Between that, I was telling people that I was a real estate investor with only $1,000 and bad credit. I’m a believer that the universe gives you what you put out. If you don’t put out there that it’s what you are and that’s what you want, why is anybody else going to believe you? Why are the things that you’re looking for going to find you? They have no reason to. I was like, “I’ll tell people I’m an investor. Hopefully, that brings me the thing that I want.” That’s 100% how I found my first deal.

Somebody who heard that I was a real estate investor was a friend of mine. He was like, “I heard you’re buying property. I got to sell this house in 30 days. Can you buy it?” I was like, “I can buy it.” I had no clue how to buy it. I ended up putting that property under contract and found out how to do that because I googled how to buy a house without a real estate agent. It said, “Put it under contract.” I googled, “What’s a real estate contract?” I downloaded one, changed the names and we signed it. That’s a terrible idea and people shouldn’t do it but I did it. I was like, “I’m going to figure this out.”

I had to buy it and take it to a bank. The bank said they’d give me money as long as I had 15% of the down payment. They said, “Do you have it?” I was like, “For sure, I have it.” I didn’t have that either. I had to go to my group. That was the power of networking. You mentioned that networking is so powerful and I 100% agree. People don’t leverage networking enough. Everybody goes to 1 meeting or 2 and they network but that’s not networking. That’s only going to 1 meeting or 2.

Networking is consistently showing up and being around everyone who’s doing the things that you’re doing. It’s not only going to 1 meeting or 2. It’s committing to being consistently in those circles because the more consistent you are in those circles, the more people see you as an expert, the more the universe is going to send the right people in deals and things your way. I was so consistently in this group that I had this network of friends.

This investor group is so helpful. They want to see you succeed. People want to help you out. You hear wholesalers say, “Somebody is going to steal your deal.” It’s not like that in real estate. It’s more, so somebody is going to help you make money on your deal. Everybody’s so helpful. I went to my network and I was like, “I got this house. It’s a great deal. I don’t know how to buy it. How are you buying it?”

They talked me through how to go find the money. Somebody said he could leverage a 401(k) to buy it. I was like, “I will have to go find a 401(k).” My wife had the 401(k). I went to her and I was like, “Remember that time I said we’re going to buy a property? We need to borrow $20,000 from your 401(k) to buy this house.” She said, “Let’s do it.” We bought the house. The bank called after we bought it and said, “That house had a bunch of equity. We’ll give you a line of credit on the equity so you can go buy more deals.”

I went from a panic attack to owning a house 90 days later and the bank calling me and saying, “Here’s $20,000 to go do it again.” That is mind-blowing when you’re panicking about money 90 days before that. That’s my intro to real estate investing and what changed my life. Once I bought that first one and I saw how powerful it was, I said, “I’m going to buy as many as I can as fast as I can.” That’s how we got into it.

REW Amazing | Real Estate Investing

Real Estate Investing: Real estate is the most stable way to get that passive income.


It was such an inspiring story. That was a big motivation for me to host this particular panel. I love this because so much of this is about faith. It’s about making a decision that something’s going to happen, even if there is the perceived idea that you don’t have the resources or you don’t know how. Also, get in the room. Connect to the people that are doing it. Learn from them and get connected with a supportive network. I’d love to ask that same question to Moneeka. Can you share your intro story to how you got into real estate investing and what happened to you?

My intro story to real estate happened before I was born. It started with my parents. They had an arranged marriage in India, came to this country with $200 in their pocket and didn’t know each other very well. Suddenly, they’re starting a new life because things were bad in India. They wanted a better life for themselves and their family. One of the things my dad had heard was that the golden ticket to wealth in the United States was to buy real estate. They’re thinking about this. They want to buy a primary residence.

My mom’s a doctor and my dad’s an engineer. My mom is saving all of her nickels and dimes that she makes. She’s sewing little cushions for her sofa that she made. She’s making curtains. Imagine this doctor doing all these things and saving every nickel and dime so that they can buy real estate because that’s the dream. I was born 2 years later as their 1st child. Filled with that feeling of love, joy and hope for this new baby, they finally bought their first home. They bought their primary residence and then also an investment property soon after that.

They bought their primary residence when I was born. Three years later, they started their investing journey. It’s been my whole life. Fast forward fifteen years, they were able to pay for my college education and my wedding with real estate. They did the same for both of my sisters. My whole life, I had seen what real estate could do. I’d also seen my dad’s stress with tenants not paying rent, dealing with the different mortgages and juggling all the different phone calls from their tenants, the toilets and the termites. We hear about this stuff and this is what scares people away from it. I saw that.

I have to tell you, I had dug my heels in. I was like, “I do not want that life.” One of these things that I learned about real estate was it’s a long game. You want to be in there for a long time. If I was going to do a long game, I was not going to do something that was going to be miserable. I was clear on that. I decided, “No, thank you.” I graduated from college during a recession. I couldn’t find a job. I had a great degree from UC Berkeley.

I remember one day sitting with my dad and I’m like, “How am I going to do the adulting thing? What’s going to happen to me?” My dad said something to me that night that changed everything. He said, “Do you know, Moneeka? Everybody has stress, fear and money problems. Do you want poor people’s money problems or do you want rich people’s money problems?” My first thought was, “Do rich people have money problems?” They do but they are better problems.

My whole mindset changed. It was like, “I want this.” I got a low-paying job. I took whatever I could get. I swallowed my pride with a UC Berkeley degree. I did what my mom did. I started saving nickels and dimes so that I could buy my first piece of real estate. In the meantime, I fell in love. My sweet husband and I decided we wanted real estate. For our wedding, we asked everybody no gifts. We wanted a down payment for the house. Everybody gave us money.

We put together $10,000 and then went for an FHA loan. We’ve tried that but it didn’t work for us. We put down 5% on a $200,000 property. We were broke but we had this house. This is how we got it. In those days, we called house hacking getting a roommate. We got a roommate and that’s how we afforded our first house. We lived with this roommate for a few years. We got an equity line on the home once it had appreciated and then did it again. We rented this out.

That’s how we got started and the rest is history. My very first rental home was a nightmare. It was like my dad’s because that’s what I had learned. That’s what had been modeled for me. We sold that first property. My husband’s like, “You are so going to regret this,” and he was not wrong. We got rid of that property because I was like, “I can’t stand this headache,” but then with the next one, I realized what real estate could do for us.

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Henry, thank you for that decision idea. I made another decision that this was going to be the thing that I did but it was going to be happy for me. I was going to create my model. I was going to streamline my processes. I was going to create something that I could live with for the rest of my life, which is what I did. That’s how I began. For the first 4, 5 and 6 years, I would buy a primary residence because they’re the easiest to get into. They require the lowest down payment. The loans are easy to qualify for. You have to pay rent, so you might as well pay yourself.

I buy another primary residence and then rent that out. That’s how I got started until, eventually, I had enough equity in my homes that I could go shopping. It was like a monopoly. “I can go buy ten,” but it took a little time to get there and I had given myself the time. I wanted to do this in a way that felt good to me. That was my journey.

It’s important to focus on doing whatever you need to and get it going. It may not feel easy in the beginning. When you’re starting something new, there’s a certain amount of resistance you have to work through. That’s one hard part. The other thing is making decisions that may be in the short-term don’t feel the best but in the long-term are going to be beneficial. You have this pocket of money and put it into the house, so you don’t have that money anymore. That can feel not so great. You’re like, “I don’t have that $10,000,” or whatever it is that you put into a house or, “I’m getting a roommate.”

In the long-term, that’s going to be a good decision. Not to get too caught up in whatever’s happening at the moment. If it fits into your long-term vision for yourself, know that it can be worthwhile. It was on another podcast interview where you talked about how when the recession hit, the housing crashed. You made the tough decision to move out of your house and rent it so that you could keep it. That was not easy but in the long-term, it was a great decision for you.

There’s no clear path to wealth. One of my coaches said to me, “The person with the most flexibility wins.” The word pivot was used during the pandemic a lot. If you’re able to dance with what’s happening out there in the world and your life, you’re going to be able to create more of that wealth more easily. Many people that were in my situation lost everything. I lost several million dollars in six months in 2008 in 2009 but I made some different decisions than other people. I didn’t freak out, get scared or think the market was ever going to come back.

I decided, “This sucks. What am I going to do?” What I was going to do was hold my properties and figure out how to make it work. All of us have choices in every moment. Our knowledge, as Henry, Patricia, Mike and everybody’s talking about is to get educated. As you’re in those environments hearing the conversations and you’ve got that education, it makes it a lot easier to do that dance, pivot and change your strategy based on what’s going on. You’ve got a wealth of information that’ll help you to build your financial wealth.

That story made me want to give your mom a big hug. To come over here with $250 and she started saving her nickels to help buy that property, I want to hug that lady.

My parents are amazing. I’m so blessed.

Another thing to stress is it seems to me there is likely to be another recession here with inflation being so high. We’ll see how long and serious this goes but it still can be a good time for you. That doesn’t mean that it’s not a time to be in real estate or you’re going to lose everything. You have to be aware and make smart decisions based on what’s happening.

REW Amazing | Real Estate Investing

Real Estate Investing: If you can dance with what’s happening in the world and your life, you can create more of that wealth easily.


With that determination and will, you can still make it work even in this perceived challenging time. Most millionaires are made and billionaires too, often in times of economic downturn. What is challenging in some ways is a bigger opportunity in different ways. Much of this is about reframing as well.

Real estate is the best recession-resistant vehicle to invest in because rents go up as inflation goes up. There are other factors too. That’s oversimplifying it but real estate is the vehicle that can help us to weather that inflation storm, depending on how you invest.

We were talking before about how everybody needs a place to live. Maybe eventually it’ll be fully in VR and that won’t even be the case but at least for the perceived future, people need a place to live. People will always need that, whereas other things are negotiable. You need food and a place to live.

Real estate is a finite resource. A lot of people don’t realize that, especially in areas where growth has already happened and there are restrictions on open space and building. Considering the idea that it’s a finite resource, you got to get yours.

Where people can work from remotely anywhere, it’s opened up a lot more different real estate markets that people hadn’t necessarily considered living in before because they’re like, “It’s not accessible to my job.” These rural markets have amazing and affordable properties. Even when we went out to Iowa and we started doing our long-terms in Iowa, it was this scary first out-of-state thing. It was freaky but it works out because different areas have different regional economics. Ultimately, you can invest with lower amounts of money but still bring in some cashflow.

We cashflow beautifully on properties that we purchased for $125,000 each. People need places to live. They need nice, beautiful spaces. To build on what Henry and Moneeka said, it’s important in real estate. You want to sit with yourself and figure out what your strengths and weaknesses are. What do you want to do? What energizes you? The best way to be successful is to be authentically yourself. I try to tell people this all the time. Be authentically yourself. It’s a struggle for us. Every day, I’m wondering, “Maybe I should do this but that doesn’t suit me.” I’m trying to always center back on being authentically ourselves. When you are, you have more potential to get further.

I’ll comment on the whole flexibility thing. If you’re ultimately not a real estate investor and you think about being flexible, it’s that uncomfortability of having a roommate or those things where you wouldn’t necessarily normally do it. If you move out of your house for a little while, which we’ve all done, you move out of your primary into another primary, you get that primary going, the house is where you make a home at that moment and it’s a thing you’d build on, you get a little bit uncomfortable for some periods. You have to be okay with some of those levels of comfort. It’s like, “You can go a couple of years without having a walk-in closet that you love.” If you have a place that you are like, “This is going to be great to rent out,” spend a year there and then move on to the next property.

Wealth is built outside of your comfort zone.

One of the things I tell my tenants is, “You’re paying my mortgage. She can sit there paying your own.” I tell my tenants to leave me. I’m telling everybody, “Leave your landlord,” because you’re going to pay somebody’s mortgage. When the recession got tough, my husband lost his job and stuff like that, when we moved out of our dream home, where we built our whole life together. We finally bought our dream home and then we needed to rent it out.

The more consistent you're in networking, the more people see you as an expert, and the more the universe will send the right people and deals and things you're away. Share on X

He finally got a job and we moved into a dump. When I walked in there, it smelled like dog pee. Everything inside has been spray-painted gray. It was horrible. I walked in there and broke down crying but it was all we could afford and they will not pay rent. We had to buy it because that’s one of my policies. Don’t pay somebody else’s mortgage. Whatever we could do is what we did and it worked out beautifully in the end. That flexibility thing is so important. It can be your superpower to build that flexibility muscle.

This is good in life, not just real estate investing, if you can see the whole picture. We’re getting close to the end of the hour. Patricia and Mike, briefly, if you could share a brief version of your first real estate investment and then we’ll wrap up.

I’m originally from New York. I grew up in Brooklyn. This is a very rent culture city. Unless your parents had generational wealth and had a home that they owned already, you typically rented and don’t buy because it seems so daunting and scary. I moved out to Colorado in 2011. I purchased my first home ever in the beginning of 2012 for $305,000. Two years later, we sold it for $400,000. Even to purchase that house, I took a loan against my 401(k) to make that happen. I love paying myself back.

Henry said I didn’t know how I was going to fund the down payment. I thought I would take money out of the disbursement but I was researching and found out you can take a loan against your 401(k). You pay yourself back with interest and I was all about that life. I also learned that it doesn’t hit your debt-to-income ratio. That’s a small tidbit for people out there.

I was bit by the bug. I bought another place in 2014 for $245,000. I sold it 2 years later for $320,000. I was like, “I am getting into real estate.” I made that decision because this was working out. Why wouldn’t you get into real estate? This is crazy. The Colorado market had risen quite a bit and it continues to appreciate year over year for crazy numbers. That’s where it was.

I started by renting out a room. We then moved out and bought another place and rented that place out. We moved out of that one and rented that place out. That’s how we built our real estate portfolio and gained access to home equity lines of credit. That’s how our journey began. In 2021, we sold one of our most appreciating properties.

We jumped into the short-term rental market with a lot of appreciation that we had gained on one of the houses that we owned in Golden. Here we are and we’re doing well. We own two short-term rental properties plus our long-term. We plan on continuing this journey of purchasing long-term and maybe purchasing another luxury short-term rental.

I do advertising mostly for video games and real estate as well because I like it. When she started doing short-term rentals and came to me saying, “I’m not getting any bookings,” I was like, “It’s okay. I’ll run some ads.” She’s like, “Don’t tell me it’s okay.”

“What are you talking about? Do you know what the mortgage is?”

REW Amazing | Real Estate Investing

Real Estate Investing: Real estate is the best recession-resistant vehicle to invest in because rents go up as inflation goes up.


I’m like, “That’s all good.” I’ve been running advertising on Facebook, Instagram and different things like that for so long, especially for real estate. I was like, “This is going to be easy.” I started running ads for short-term rentals and it got easy. We were able to bring in massive amounts of people and increased our Law of Averages to get bookings.

I have this lever I can turn on and off and she feels like, “We’re getting views and bookings. I feel like it’s normal.” I’m like, “It’s cool.” I’ve been able to take that, create a system, help out a bunch of other short-term rental hosts and develop even advertising methodologies for them to follow us that way so they can find success on their own. I’ve pivoted my business a little bit to focus more on that in 2022.

I wrote a book, How to Excel at Short Term Rental: Advertising. I have a whole bunch of things happening in the real estate investing side of things, shifted and pivoted more of my day job focus and then I’m like, “I have more fun and a little bit more exciting times. I get to talk to all these cool real estate investors.” Instead of making the videos for real estate investors who are 20-year-old kids who learned how to wholesale at 18 and have 30 properties, which is amazing.

I was like, “I don’t know how to do that.” To Henry’s point, I was like, “You have to surround yourself with these people.” Ultimately, when you start talking to other investors and we find the different flavors of real estate, there are all these things that you can end up benefiting from by providing services for it.

I’m glad that you brought up short-term rentals because that’s a viable option. It’s a very different business model but I was talking with a friend here in Las Vegas who has three short-term rentals that bring in about $1 million a year. It can be real income. You have to know the rules and everything. In certain places, it’s allowed and not allowed. Do whatever you need to do to make sure that it’s legal but it can be a viable path to income.

There’s been a huge influx of investors who were rushing to short-term rentals but that’s where Mike comes in because if you’re treating it like a business, you should be advertising it. The more people who see your property is casting a wider net of people who are likely to book your property without waiting on the platform to get you invested.

There’s going to be a lot of cross-pollination within the panel itself. I’m excited for all of you to connect. I was like, “I can’t wait for you all to meet each other.” For anyone who’s reading, I love these panels. You and everyone can already see how amazing all of these individuals are. They have so much knowledge in different areas and backgrounds, which I love.

If you want to further your connection and learn more about real estate, I’m hosting an 11th-Month Real Estate Magical Mastermind. I’m calling it magical because I know that it will be. All these fabulous panelists are experts in the class. I’d love to have you. You can find out more about that on PowersHour.biz. You can look under the classes.

Feel free to reach out if you have any questions about it. It’s at [email protected] to contact me. I want to thank all of you so much for your time. I’m excited to see what happens, hear more about your journeys and learn more. Even though I’m posting this real estate class, I’m learning from all of you and I’m so grateful. Everyone’s going to learn from you as well. Any final closing thoughts that you have that you want to give out to people as we wrap up? I’ll start with Moneeka.

The best way to be successful is to be authentically yourself. Share on X

I already gave you my closing. Goals without action are just dreams, so take action. I do have one other thing that I want to mention that is very relevant because we’re not all real estate investors. Remember that bliss is your birthright, so choose bliss every single day.

Henry, how about you?

I gave some mindset at the top of the show to talk about how to get started. I’ll give some tactical at the bottom of the show. Actual tactical things you can do to get started investing in real estate. You have to put the blinders on because it’s so flexible. There are so many ways to get started. It’s going to be overwhelming. There are so many options for you. Find the lowest common denominator among all the options and that is typically always going to be a good deal. It doesn’t matter how you’re going to monetize a property.

If you’re going to flip it, rent it, short-term rental, long-term rental, wholesale or wholetail it, all of these strategies require you to buy something at a discount that’s a good enough deal so that when you add value to it by fixing it up, putting tenants in it or furnishing it and renting it out, you can turn a profit. If the lowest common denominator is finding a good deal, then that’s where your focus should be. Don’t worry about all the other stuff like who’s going to finance it, who’s going to work on it, who’s the contractor going to be, who’s the title company or who’s the real estate agent. None of those things matter until you find a deal.

Find a deal. Figure out what a good deal looks like in the market. If you’re looking to buy real estate, you can do that simply by networking and asking people what they’re buying. Figure out how you’re going to find those good deals. You can google, “How do I find under-market value real estate deals?” You’ll get a ton of options. It’s direct mail, cold calls, on the market or off the market. There are all these strategies.

Pick the one that you think you can implement the easiest that you can apply the right amount of money and time to. Do it relentlessly consistently until you get a deal. Once you get a deal, you’ll be so motivated to go figure all that other stuff out that I’ve mentioned before because you’ll have that thing in your hand that you so worked hard for. People will line up to give you those resources because you’ve brought them something of substance. Take everything off the table, put your blinders on, figure out what a good deal looks like and be relentlessly consistent about finding one until you do.

Patricia and Mike, any closing thoughts for the two of you?

Be authentically yourself. Sit with yourself for a little while and figure out what your strengths and weaknesses are. What do you like to do as it relates to real estate? What do you think you want to do? What are you willing to try? Take action on those things. Learn more about how you can get involved. If you try something and you don’t like it, you don’t have to stick with it. There are so many different ways to get involved. Most importantly, start educating yourself about the different ways or what it is you want to do.

In the corporate world, Patricia, we call that a SWOT Analysis. You sit down and do your strengths, weaknesses, opportunities and threats. You write them all down. That is your point of attack.

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Real Estate Investing: Bliss is your birthright. So, choose bliss every single day.


Also, make the decision. “I’m going to get involved in real estate.” That’s what you got to do. Don’t lose yourself in it.

One thing I’ll leave off with is even after you’ve dove into something, it’s okay to spaghetti test. Everything is a test. It’s not anything you have to commit to. I try a bunch of things at once. I see what sticks, resonates and reflects the value that we have. The reality of investing in the short-term and long-term where we hadn’t done that in 2022 is a freaky thing. Be like, “I know systems that work and the ways in which we can increase some of the viability of it.”

As you go into something, there are always ways that you can increase its effectiveness of it. You can get more investors to even add to it. It syndicates. There are all these things that you can do with other people’s money, like seller financing options. Finding those off-market deals and getting people to even be involved and you renting from the person who owns it. You are paying them their actual fee instead of a bank and you take over the actual deed later on. There is all this different stuff that takes conversation and trying it out. Explore and be unafraid to try new things.

Everyone, thanks for participating. I appreciate your time and energy. I’m excited about the mastermind.

Thank you for having us.

If you’d like more information about me, you can go to my website, PowersHour.biz. You can find me on Twitter @ThatLauraPowers, Instagram @LauraPowers44 and also on Facebook. Thanks for reading.


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